Rusty&Chip Posted July 11, 2004 Share Posted July 11, 2004 [url]http://www.gotpetsonline.com/cgi-bin/Eware/view_ads.cgi?process=Search&row=0&parent_cat_key=4&cat_key=&order_by=creation_date%20desc[/url] :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: THIS MAKES ME SO MAD!!!!!!!!!! THESE PEOPLE ARE SELLING TIGERS AND OTHER WILD ANIMALS AS PETS! I know this has nothing to do with dogs, but it makes me SOOOO MAD!!! :evil: :evil: THESE ANIMALS AREN'T MEANT TO BE KEPT AS PETS!!!!!! Is this even legal???!?!?!?! Sorry, I just had to rant for a minute..... :evil: :evil: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smooshie Posted July 11, 2004 Share Posted July 11, 2004 I'm speechless... [quote]Wanted Caption: I want a Siberian Tiger Please!!! Babies Ad Information: Breed: Siberian Tiger Ad Number: 3636 Date Posted: 05/06/2004 Price: $950 Ad Text: Im trying to find a baby Siberian Tiger! im an only child and always wanted a tiger for a friend! My mom said i can have one if i come up with the money and i only can get 950 right now. So please e-mail me and send me pictures. Thanks. [/quote] [quote]Wanted Caption: I really love capuchins! Ad Information: Breed: Capuchin Monkey Ad Number: 2023 Date Posted: 02/15/2004 Price: 50.00 Ad Text: I want a capuchin that will not bite is in good health loves people is a baby and is well trained. [/quote] :o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty&Chip Posted July 11, 2004 Author Share Posted July 11, 2004 [quote]5 tiger cubs, just born, $750 each. Also available is mom, a bengal tigress, 5 years old, always has five cubs in every litter; very sweet cat and very good mother. 2.5 year old bengal/siberian hybrid tiger male; very sweet guy.[/quote] :snipersmile: I'm sorry....but this just really makes me mad.... :evil: [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malamum Posted July 11, 2004 Share Posted July 11, 2004 I really am dumbfounded........ I can't undertand that it is even legal to keep these types of animals as pets. Until I joined this site and others had mentioned it, it never in a million years would have even occured to me that people keep tigers etc as pets. :o :o :o :o [quote]Wanted Caption: I want a Siberian Tiger Please!!! Babies Ad Information: Breed: Siberian Tiger Ad Number: 3636 Date Posted: 05/06/2004 Price: $950 Ad Text: Im trying to find a baby Siberian Tiger! im an only child and always wanted a tiger for a friend! My mom said i can have one if i come up with the money and i only can get 950 right now. So please e-mail me and send me pictures. Thanks. [/quote] This girl doesn't need a tiger! She needs a good smack and a kick in the arse :evil: :evil: :evil: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastie_wife Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 When I first read this I thought it had to do with reptiles (ie exotics) and was about to go on about how good they can be as pets..... People can be such jackasses. There is a reason certain things are quantified as pets, and others are not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpeigirl Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 I think someone needs a friend!! Not a tiger!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty&Chip Posted July 12, 2004 Author Share Posted July 12, 2004 [quote name='Sharpeigirl']I think someone needs a friend!! Not a tiger!!!!![/quote] I agree completely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
courtnek Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 [quote name='Malamum']I really am dumbfounded........ I can't undertand that it is even legal to keep these types of animals as pets. Until I joined this site and others had mentioned it, it never in a million years would have even occured to me that people keep tigers etc as pets. :o :o :o :o [quote]Wanted Caption: I want a Siberian Tiger Please!!! Babies Ad Information: Breed: Siberian Tiger Ad Number: 3636 Date Posted: 05/06/2004 Price: $950 Ad Text: Im trying to find a baby Siberian Tiger! im an only child and always wanted a tiger for a friend! My mom said i can have one if i come up with the money and i only can get 950 right now. So please e-mail me and send me pictures. Thanks. [/quote] This girl doesn't need a tiger! She needs a good smack and a kick in the arse :evil: :evil: :evil:[/quote] in most places, at least here in the states, you have to have a special wild animal license to have these critters. and prove you can provide them with a home as close as possible to their native homes. My guess is that these are being sold illegaly. and this site should be SHUT DOWN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malamum Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 Ahh that makes a bit more sense. It's still quite disturbing that people can get access to these animals (even if it is illegally). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bk_blue Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 :o :o :o :o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mutts4Me Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 [quote name='Rusty&Chip'] THESE ANIMALS AREN'T MEANT TO BE KEPT AS PETS!!!!!! Is this even legal???!?!?!?! Sorry, I just had to rant for a minute..... :evil: :evil:[/quote] [quote name='courtnek']in most places, at least here in the states, you have to have a special wild animal license to have these critters. and prove you can provide them with a home as close as possible to their native homes. My guess is that these are being sold illegaly. and this site should be SHUT DOWN.[/quote] That website should be shut down. But the assumption that this kind of thing is illegal or even well regulated is false. Common, but very, very wrong. There are less than 20 states where it's illegal to own a lion or a tiger as a pet. There are 16 states without any state laws regarding the ownership of exotic species. The rest are either partial bans (some kinds, not all) or else they leave it up to the county. That girl who wants a Siberian tiger for a friend is in Ohio, and Ohio is one of the states without laws prohibiting that kind of thing. So is Minnesota, where another tiger ad is from. I've already forgotten the rest of the states where tiger ads were coming from. But No, they're probably NOT being sold illegally. It's very easy to get a breeder's license for exotics like wild cats. Anyone breeding them, no matter what state they're in, does need a federal license from the USDA, but they're very easy to get, and very easy to keep. As far as owning them (but not breeding), MOST areas don't do home checks, and you don't have to prove anything. MOST places simply require you to get a permit or license, which is often as easy as getting a license for your dog. Sale over the internet is not illegal, and exotic animal auctions are big events throughout the South. People come from all over to buy and sell, and no one does checks to make sure people can take care of the animals, or even if it's legal in their area to have them OH HECK. I just wrote an essay about this, so I'm going to post it at the NDR forum. It'll give everyone a better idea of what we're facing, maybe, and it'll also help me out if people can read it and give me ideas from unbiased minds. Here we go. Please check it out: [url]http://forum.dogomania.com/viewtopic.php?p=175687[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seijun Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 I support RESPONSABLE exotic animal ownership, but seriously, it's those 'wanted' ads that scare me the most! :o I stopped reading after page ten.. Too many people there looking for any sort of big exotic animal they can get their slimy little hands on. :drinking: ~Seij Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cairn6 Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 [quote name='Seijun']I support RESPONSABLE exotic animal ownership, but seriously, it's those 'wanted' ads that scare me the most! :o I stopped reading after page ten.. Too many people there looking for any sort of big exotic animal they can get their slimy little hands on. :drinking: ~Seij[/quote] How on earth can the average person ever been considered a responsible owner of a wild animal. Perhaps a really good zoo with a very natural habitat but other then that who could be possibly justified in owning one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarFox Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 Most people can't even take care of a dog our cat! How in the heck is your average person going to take care of Big cats, monkeys etc?! The ad that confused me the most was the "Polar bear" one...why in the world would anyone want a POLAR BEAR! There not exactly known to be the nicest creatures! That site is just SCARY! :-? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seijun Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 [quote name='Cairn6'][quote name='Seijun']I support RESPONSABLE exotic animal ownership, but seriously, it's those 'wanted' ads that scare me the most! :o I stopped reading after page ten.. Too many people there looking for any sort of big exotic animal they can get their slimy little hands on. :drinking: ~Seij[/quote] How on earth can the average person ever been considered a responsible owner of a wild animal. Perhaps a really good zoo with a very natural habitat but other then that who could be possibly justified in owning one.[/quote] I know. Very, VERY few people out there could properly care for large wild animals. That's why I said I supported [b]responsible[/b] ownership (the average person would not even come close to fulfilling this requirement). I definitely think there should be laws in place though to make it difficult for just anyone to go out and buy something as large as a Siberian Tiger. I wouldn't want to ban exotic ownership completely, just make it so that it is no longer perfectly legal for just anyone who wants an exotic large cat, bear, or other animal to get one. My friend has a lion and tiger as pets. They are both well cared for, loved, and contained. Most of the time though, when you hear about someone with a pet lion or tiger or something, they are keeping it in a decrepit homemade cage of sorts that even a two year old could escape from, or they are like the guy I heard about last year who tried keeping a tiger and alligator in his APARTMENT! :roll: ~Seij Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seijun Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 Yes, that is all perfectly legal, UNLESS the animal is native to your area, (or the area you live in has specific laws about owning wild/exotic animals), then you have to have permits to keep it. Keep in mind though that just because an animal is a 'wild' animal does not mean it can't be kept as a pet. Reptiles, and most birds and fish kept as pets, can all be found in the wild. If you chose to define a wild animal as any animal that can be found in the wild, then pet parrots, snakes, lizards, and many fish, are all 'wild' animals. FYI, most of the 'wolf cubs' on that site are just wolf hybrids or dog mixes that someone has labeled a wolf. It happens all the time. I saw one that WAS pure wolf, so I sure hope the owner finds a responsible home for it. ~Seij Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarahstaff Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 [quote name='Mutts4Me'] That girl who wants a Siberian tiger for a friend is in Ohio, and Ohio is one of the states without laws prohibiting that kind of thing. [/quote] Waitaminute. In Ohio, they have strict laws regulating ownership of "pit bulls", but tigers are [i]perfectly legal[/i]?! What a state. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetta_Pup Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 thats crazy although any of you look at the "zhorse"? they are pretty (smacks hand) anyway id like to have a pixie bob i had one when i lived in az, there were some breeders down the road and he was the runt and they threw him out :( i asked if i could have him and they said yes. but they are a lil more common than some thing. theres a list of them on petfinder.com when we move i been talking to hubby about looking into adoption one. most people see a beautiful cat but dont see what comes w/ that BIG beautiful cat. i know when i was 13yrs old and i got Simba i didnt neither did my family but we soon learned. Simba is still in AZ living w/ my g-pa and going on 8yrs old :) hes big fat ole cow! ill try to see if i can find some pics of him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetta_Pup Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 ok heres some of simba and he was actually really young in these pics..LOL [img]http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3cc01b3127cce843112a70b540000001610[/img] No we did not keep him in a cage and feed him grass and carrots..LOL thats my rabbit cage when we were outside we would let her out and he would get up there to sleep..lol he sleeps in weird places the pic above he was inside my brothers 4runner..lol [img]http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3cc35b3127cce83aba6fdc0cd0000002611[/img] you can kinda tell in that pic his head was starting to get big. fat head..LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seijun Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 [quote name='Dog Lover'][quote name='Seijun']Yes, that is all perfectly legal, UNLESS the animal is native to your area, (or the area you live in has specific laws about owning wild/exotic animals), then you have to have permits to keep it. Keep in mind though that just because an animal is a 'wild' animal does not mean it can't be kept as a pet. Reptiles, and most birds and fish kept as pets, can all be found in the wild. If you chose to define a wild animal as any animal that can be found in the wild, then pet parrots, snakes, lizards, and many fish, are all 'wild' animals. FYI, most of the 'wolf cubs' on that site are just wolf hybrids or dog mixes that someone has labeled a wolf. It happens all the time. I saw one that WAS pure wolf, so I sure hope the owner finds a responsible home for it. ~Seij[/quote] True, but then again you don't have to really worry about a fish attacking you. Well, unless it is a Pirana or something like that...Some people keep tigers as they would keep a dog and then are surprised when one day it attacks them. Like the guy who was mauled by his tiger and tried to blame it on a pit bull. :roll: Or the tiger incident with Siggy and Roy. People have got to realize that these are not domesticated animals. A wolf cub may be cute, but it's not a domesticated dog. It's wild...[/quote] There are some large snakes kept as pets that can and have killed small children and adults. Again, responsibility is a must, especially when owning an animal with the potential to kill you. When posting an ad there, it asks you the type of animal it is, and it gives you a list to chose from. Most of the people with the 'wolves' were actually selling wolf hybrids, but they have to put 'wolf' down as the animal type, as there is no 'wolf hybrid' choice. Wolves do not make good 'pets' but wolf hybrids [b]can[/b] make good pets. It all depends on how much wolf is in them and how experienced the owner is with keeping wolf hybrids. Only wolfdogs with very little wolf in them would have a chance of making a good pet for the average pet owner though. ~Seij Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abker17 Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 [quote]There are some large snakes kept as pets that can and have killed small children and adults. Again, responsibility is a must, especially when owning an animal with the potential to kill you. When posting an ad there, it asks you the type of animal it is, and it gives you a list to chose from. Most of the people with the 'wolves' were actually selling wolf hybrids, but they have to put 'wolf' down as the animal type, as there is no 'wolf hybrid' choice. Wolves do not make good 'pets' but wolf hybrids can make good pets. It all depends on how much wolf is in them and how experienced the owner is with keeping wolf hybrids. Only wolfdogs with very little wolf in them would have a chance of making a good pet for the average pet owner though. ~Seij[/quote] I can see where you're coming from, but I think you're missing the main point. IMO, we have to take extra care with wild animals. More so than with a dog or cat. Even just part wild, like the wolf hybrid. Just like that incident with Siggy and Roy with the tiger, I'm pretty sure they had hand raised that tiger. But it was still a wild animal, and Roy fully knew the risk he was taking and acknowleged(sp?) that when he was attacked. What I'm trying to say is EVEN IF a wolf is much different from a tiger, and even if it is wolf hybrids we are talking about, it still has that wild animal in it, and you can never truely tame a wild animal like DL has already stated. Therefore I don't think they should be legal for the normal citizen to own, as most of us wouldn't know how to properly handle one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seijun Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 I understand what you are saying. I have owned and worked with many different wild animals. I do not consider many to be 'pets' in the same sense as a dog or a cat is a pet. They can be kept as pets, but most should not be kept as you would a dog or a cat. The larger types of wild animals do not do well in a home setting and require a setting that mimics their natural habitat. ~Seij Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mutts4Me Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 [quote name='Seijun']I know. Very, VERY few people out there could properly care for large wild animals. That's why I said I supported [b]responsible[/b] ownership (the average person would not even come close to fulfilling this requirement). I definitely think there should be laws in place though to make it difficult for just anyone to go out and buy something as large as a Siberian Tiger. I wouldn't want to ban exotic ownership completely, just make it so that it is no longer perfectly legal for just anyone who wants an exotic large cat, bear, or other animal to get one. My friend has a lion and tiger as pets. They are both well cared for, loved, and contained. [/quote] That's great that your friend takes care of them. Most people don't. But there's still no reason for people to keep them, even if they can "responsibly" care for them. They're wild animals. Something like a lion or a tiger is not meant to spend its life in a CAGE. I don't care if it's a 1/4 acre habitat or a 20' x 20' cage, it's still a cage, and it's still a tiny fraction of the amount of land they should be able to wander. They'll never be able to live up to their full potential to be a skillful, graceful hunter. So say you CAN "properly" take care of a Big Cat. It's still irresponsible of you to buy one. Why? Well, first of all, you're supporting a breeder who's almost certainly breeding for profit - breeding an animal that shouldn't be bred in captivity, especially for private ownership. Second of all, there is no way to be certain that your area is always going to let you keep them. While too slow for my tastes, laws are being enacted all over the country, starting at the county level, banning these animals. Some have a "grandfather" clause, letting you keep them if you already have them, but some don't. We have a lion and a tiger raised by the same man together, and they were reasonably well taken care of, though the female is probably inbred. The laws in his county changed and he had a limited amount of time to get them out, or they would be euthanized. We didn't have room for them, but due to the desparate circumstances, we squeezed them in. They had 3 days before their deadline when they got here. Thirdly, it's very expensive to maintain a Big Cat, what with the proper containment areas and the 50-60 pounds of raw meat per week, not to mention medical costs (and even finding a vet who'll work on one!). So what happens if your financial situation falters? You lose your job, you get divorced, whatever. Suddenly there's a very expensive problem on your hands. This can happen with dogs and cats as well, but they're a lot less expensive to maintain than a Big Cat, and if necessary, they have a much better chance of being rehomed (and considering the fact that it's not easy to rehome a dog or a cat, that's saying a lot). A couple months ago we had to turn down 3 Cats who were owned by a divorcing couple, and neither could afford to support them on their own. More reasons? Lions and Tigers hit maturity around 3 years old. Things tend to change at that point. Imagine your average teenager, who may have been daddy's little girl all her life, and suddenly she hits maturity and goes wild. That's not uncommon here, either. We actually get the majority of our cats between the ages of 1 and 3, because that's when they stop being cute, cuddly, and (most importantly for many) controllable. They start getting stronger, breaking out, and eating more. Sometimes their personalities change. We've got two brothers who were rescued as cubs in 96. They've lived together since then, and just had to be separated in April because they suddenly hated each other. In another sibling group of 4, one female had to be separated after living in the group for years because she suddenly started attacking her brother incessantly. A Siberian tiger who was hand raised, bottle fed, leash trained, and surrounded by people all his life suddenly became antisocial after maturity hits, and now he's one of the animals we can't pet, and he's one of the scariest animals for us to feed. He's never been abused, he's just a tiger. After having seen what I've seen, I'm firmly of the opinion that it is never, ever responsible to have a lion, tiger, cougar, etc. as a pet. Ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malamum Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 Excellent post Amber. I agree with you 100%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seijun Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 Amber, Tigers and lions don't need as much room in captivity as they do in the wild because they don't NEED to hunt. I have seen my friend's lion and tiger, and the one word that fits both is L-A-Z-Y. They have no need to hunt, therefor they have no need of an extremely large habitat. They are happy to just lay around in the sun all day and sleep. Just because you can not give a tiger or lion acres and acres of room doesn't mean it is living in a cage. You seem to think that because an animal is a wild animal, it belongs in the wild and shouldn't be kept as a pet. This isn't always true. I think many of us have to be careful though by what we define as exotic or wild. Many people define an exotic/wild animal as being any animal that can be found living in the wild, in its natural habitat. All reptiles, and the majority of the bird and fish species kept as pets, are descendants of wild-caught animals, or are wild caught themselves. Even a pet as harmless as a cockatiel would fall under the name wild or exotic, as cockatiels are not a domestic animal, and can be found living in the wild, in their natural habitat. By many people's definition, the only non-wild/exotic animals out there are things like domestic dogs, cats, horses, pigs, etc. If you think lions and tigers belong in the wild because they are wild animals, then do you also think that because, technically, reptiles, most birds, and most fish are wild, they should no longer be kept as pets? If a captive bred, captive raised tiger is still 'wild', then is a captive bred, captive raised parakeet still 'wild'? One other thing.. If it is irrisponsable to own a lion/tiger because the laws in your area might change, then is it irrisponsible to own a pit bull since so many areas have started banning them as well? By your own deffinition, ANYONE who gets a pet who is it ANY risk of being banned in that area is now an irrisponsible owner. IMO, this sort of judgement isn't fair to anyone. There are places that ban SNAKES from being owned. I own snakes, history has showed that some places do ban them, so does that make me irrisponsible? I don't think you should label someone irrisponsible just because something [b]could[/b] happen to their pets. Sure, financial situations could cause a person to lose their pet tiger, laws could cause them to lose their pet tiger, a divirce could cause them to lose their pet tiger, but that ISN'T THEIR FAULT!. Any of us who own pets take the risk of losing our pet because of these reasons. I have seen TONS of dogs and cats PTS because of the reasons you listed above. That doesn't make their owners bad owners. You can say the reasons you listed are reasons you might not want to get a large wild animal like a lion or tiger, but you cannot say that they make someone irrisponsible who does buy a lion or tiger. ~Seij Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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