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MajiesMom

Dog Parks

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Can be good and can be bad but unfortunatly it depends on the owner of the dog to decide which it is for them and as we all know there are a lot of stupid dog owners out there.

My dog is very dominant towards other dogs so I keep him away from off-leash areas - it's just not fair on the other dogs and owners.

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Can I ask why u think it's a bad idea Black GSD? We don't have one around here, even if we did I couldn't go to it cause Abby's dog aggressive and Cracker is scared of most other dogs but I'm just wondering as to why it would be a bad idea?

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In dog parks, most dogs are usually free to run and there are a lot of stupid or ignorant people who take their fear/aggressive/not always well socialized/not always trained well dogs and let them run free.

Also, people a lot of times forget that dogs may get along with other dogs or people regularly but that is not to say they will get along with every dog/person or become defensive for one reason or another. No matter how nice you are you don't get along with or feel comfortable around every other person you come in contact with. Dogs are no different.

To put animals in an environment with this much freedom...especially if these dogs visit regularly and could become territorial just isn't safe for anyone.

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I understand why Dog Parks are popular. It's a place for city dwellers to let your dog run freely off leash, but I too feel the disadvantages outweigh the advantages.

Many dogs become aggressive from being attacked by other dogs at Dog Parks. Small dogs are often hurt or killed by larger dogs if they are not segregated.

Not to mention the *disease* issue. I'm sure that would be a real good place for your dog to pick up Sarcoptic Mange, ringworm etc., as well as other common illnesses.

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I think being able to run loose in a semi wooded area is GREAT for a dog. (Providing it has a solid recall so the owner can get the dog back. :wink: )

The thing is, that if the dog never has gotten to "run loose..." they don't know they are missing out. It's not like they watch Animal Planet and think "I wish I could do that". :wink: )

(Not trying to make fun of you here, just trying to make a point. :D )

I have a problem with the dog having to run in that semi wooded area with gawd knows HOW many other strange, ill mannered dogs and their idiot owners.

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Excellent points. I have the proper opportunity to let the boys offlead BTW, Zaphod's recall needs serious work and he startles easily and Kavik doesn't like unnuetered males that are taller than him :niewiem: The dog park naturally is out of the question, so I have never had to think whether or not it is someplace I want to take the boys.

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Well I live in "the middle of nowhere" ()there are only about 500 or so in the whole town.)so i don't have to worry about dog parks either. Besides, we have 100 acres here at the house and another 5000 across the lake on the ranch. So I don't have to "go" somewhere to let the dogs run. I just have to open the front door. :P :wink: :D

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[quote name='DogPaddle']Intersting. For those of you against dogparks, do you think dogs miss out on anything really important by not being able to run loose in a semi-wooded area?[/quote]

I'm a little confused here. Do you mean a semi-wooded Dog Park, or just a semi-wooded area?

Either way, a dog will not *miss* what it has no knowledge of, therefore will not miss running in a Dog Park or anywhere else if it has never done it.

Personally speaking, however, I love to take my dogs on long unleashed walks through the woods and let them swim in the ponds and just be dogs!
They are not retriever's, but I trained them to a retriever whistle nevertheless, and they are ob trained so I can easily call them off a deer sighting or scent, and bring them to *heel* to pass a skunk...if I see it before they do, that is! They have been sprayed, so usually keep their distance now! :lol:

Our daily walks are our favorite part of our day and we walk rain, snow or shine and all come home refreshed but tired, and very very happy!

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They were going to put one in Brandon but they never did. To tell the truth I wish they had. I would take Jesse there but I would never take Beta there, she wasn't socialized with dogs as a pup so she doesn't get along well with most dogs. But as has been said, there is a lot of ignorant and careless people out there who would take their dog-aggressive dogs and accidents would probably happen. :(

I used to take our dogs down a very deserted road about a mile from our place for an off-leash run and to explore. They always enjoyed it very much but I've stopped going down there now, here's why:

A cougar has been raiding farms around the area(it has even attacked a horse and killed calves) and then I seen a cougar track in the dirt road, it was a couple days old and Beta never caught the scent and I was glad because I didn't want her to go chasing after it.
A couple weeks after that I went down there again with a friend and the dogs and we were going down the road and suddenly Beta wasn't with us anymore and was running back to the car. I didn't know why so I called her back and she came back after a second and was out in front again sniffing around like before. Then she suddenly smelt something again and took off back to the car with her tail and head down, obviously scared. :o I thought of the cougar right away and realized if that was what she smelt she was too smart to go messing with a cougar! So I called Jesse back and we got in the car and went home. :o Beta was still scared and wanted to go in the house. We don't go down there anymore, I don't want to meet up with the cougar especially with little Jesse there. :o

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I go back and forth depending on the situation. I definitely think it is worth it to put my dog on a leash whenever it makes for a more pleasant outing. On the other hand, there is nothing like watching my dogs romp and play in open space...it's like they are getting their "drug" fix. The older they get, the more mellow they are..another big plus. Fenced dog parks need to be huge...most I see are way too small...better off going for a good long walk on leash.

When I lived in the city...there were lots of unofficial dog parks and we loved them. My dog did not do so well with other dogs but I always brought a tennis ball and that did the trick perfectly. I loved talking to all the dog owners...it was like happy hour without the alcohol.

Now my husband did the opposite..he took his dogs on walks with a leash around the burbs and let them run loose in the school yard but they didn't get to greet too many other dogs.

When the three of us got together...his dogs went beserk at the dog park...well Cheif went beserk just seeing another dog walk on leash across the street. Belle thought is was a big "football" game and rushed every dog in sight. Very bad situation...made me tense. So no more dogs off leash when there are other dogs around.

Now we live in area where there is a lot of open space. Dogs are supposed to be on leash. I put them on leashes depending on the day of the week and time of day...say like a weekend...definitely on the leash. But on a weekday overcast morning? usually let them off the leash until I see other dogs. They come when called very well.

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I have always wished we had a dog park here. I really have no idea how Buck would do in that situation. Usually he gets along with other dogs, but if they start showing aggression he won't back down. I guess if we did get one, I would take him just to see what it would be like.

The health issue is a concern. I would hope that the dog parks require proof of immunizations before admittance...? Do they do this usually?

I have to admit that I sometimes break the leash rules in my town. I like to take Buck on a walking trail that is in our city and on very slow days I will let him off leash. It always depends on how many cars I see in the parking lot and how many people I think will be there. And usually I do it on a cold day in the afternoon in the middle of the week. Almost nobody is around. But it is against the rules and I am usually quite nervous about it. Buck has a great recall though and so far it has not been a problem. Usually if he sees a person coming, he comes back to me on his own because he knows I'm going to call him back anyway...

But I do know that if everyone did this, it would be a disaster. And for that reason I feel kind of skeevy about it.

My final opinion I think is that dog parks are generally a good idea. It's not as if they are the only place someone can take their dog, and if someone knows that it's a bad place for their animal to be, than they won't go. But if others can enjoy them safely, I say more power to them.

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I think dog parks are a good idea. Sure their are irrisponsible owners with aggressive dogs, but I've actually never met one in the dog park we go to. I have, however met a few walking their dogs on the street. Theres risks wherever you take your dog, on leash or not. and I think that as long as you have your dogs well trained and just take precautions on who you let your dogs run free with it should be ok.

But of course bad things can happen. I did say the other day Chaos got attacked by a bullmastiff. This shouldn't happen, and probably could be avoided, but if you see the pure glee on their faces when I say "do you want to go to the park?" its easy to see why you would want too. I don't think just because the dog dosen't know better they shouldn't get the chance to run free (again providing you can get them back). I've tryed to not go to the park many times but the dogs love it all three of them look sad when we walk the wrong way, so you just know thay love being there with their friends.

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[quote]I have a problem with the dog having to run in that semi wooded area with gawd knows HOW many other strange, ill mannered dogs and their idiot owners.[/quote]

that's the whole problem. People arent responsible with their dogs. I know that Freebee has a dog avoidance problem, she is very dominant. She would want them to all do things her way...Laurel would probably be fine, but who knows how many other owners have dogs like Freebee who think that it's fine to let them run loose and harass other dogs? I would never let Freebee loose in a dog park, I dont trust her. So I wont let Laurel loose either, in case there are other Freebee's around....

It took me a LONG time to find a dog that Freebee would accept and not run roughshod over. She really is a bitch (no pun intended) thanks to my ex, who thought it was funny to rile her up and let her teeth him. And no matter how many times I told him he was not helping the dog doing this, he did it anyway, when I was not home (my son confirmed this).

So she is now sequestered from dog parks. I know she would love to run loose, but I cant trust her.

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We go to two dog parks in the area and love them. We only had one problem in all the time and it was this beautiful almost white lab that ran clear across the park and tackled Chelsea. She threw a fit and was basically yelling (high pitch bark) at this dog. It's owner finally came to see what all the commotion was about and he thought Chelsea was the problem :x I came right out and told him his dog tackled her!!!! We left shortly after that.

For the most part, I think they are great. It is especially good for Chelsea who needs constant socialization. It has really helped her. We are fortunate to have a decent park in the area. They actually charge a yearly fee and are good about upkeep and poo bags and etc. There is a web site called [url]www.dogpark.com[/url] where you can find parks in your area. But, I know they are updating it and it won't be finished until the spring.

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I live just near Hampton Court Palace on the outskirts of London (Henry the 8th lived there)

The are three major Royal Parks all almost walking distance Bushey, Richmond and Home. All are full of deer and wildlife and dogs are allowed off lead but not allowed to chase the deer.

I find that 99% of all the dogs are excellent the ones that are a problem are kept on leads, but the majority are off and no problems whatsoever.

I am talking about many thousands of dogs visit these parks daily without major incidents, After reading you posts on dog parks I think your problems are training, socialisation and acclimatisation. You can't blame the parks for that, only the owners and some manically aggressive dogs

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[quote name='Doglistener'] After reading you posts on dog parks I think your problems are training, socialisation and acclimatisation. You can't blame the parks for that, only the owners and some manically aggressive dogs[/quote]

My major problems with it are other people's irresponsibility and problems with their dogs being trained well enough, and having proper socialization. I'm not so sure whether acclimatization comes into all that though since that has to do more with weather/climate and altitude environment instead of the actual physical environment which is where I think you were going.

Is that the dog parks fault? No, you are right but it is the owners who bring their dogs there. Because of that I choose to not be apart of it. I like the idea of a dog park but since I can't count on many people to pick up their dogs poop to ensure that other dogs don't pick up something from theirs or control their dog off leash because they are not trained well enough or have manners and proper socialization I choose to keep my dogs out of them. There are just too many irresponsible people out there.

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[quote]I must say I disagree with the above statements. My dog Lhiannon Sidhe dislikes smaller dogs, she always has, so I keep her on the lead. I certainly wouldn't say she's 'manically aggressive.' And she's definitely been socialized. Unfortunately, people who walk their dogs OFF-lead are the problem in our case. The dogs approach Lhiannon Sidhe wanting to be friendly, and she does not wish to be. [/quote]

May I ask why you haven't trained or behaviour modified this problem?

I see it every day, day in day out. Dogs are friendly and they go to a dog on a lead. A scream erupts get your dog away my dog she/he doesn't like other dogs. and then they start kicking the other dog that is sniffing.

The problem is never the dog on the lead according to the owners it always the dogs of the lead. Get real sort ther dog or yourself out.

Is it any wonder the dog on the lead has a problem it is related to the problem in the majority of cases to the handler not the dog.

I also prove this regulalrly by taking the lead and the dog has no problems. The main situation is the handlers angst. The dog picks up on it and reacts accordingly.

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Not always, although I agree that often the dogs on the leads are the problem. I dont take Freebee on lead or off, where there are other dogs. SOME she is fine with, OTHERS she is not, and there is no way to tell until they meet. There does not seem to be any distinction between the dogs she likes and doesnt, except that if they make any kind of dominance stance towards her, she will erupt. So I dont take her. My ex would not allow me to socialize her as a puppy, said he wanted her to be "tough" and
"strong"....I should have thrown him out then, but I didnt. So she is not socialized, I know it, and wont take the chance of her hurting or being hurt by another dog. It's up to the owner to know and react accordingly.

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good reply Mei-Mei...

yes, I KNOW Freebee is unsocialized, and I KNOW that she is a risk around other dogs. I have been working with her for years trying to calm her tendencies to want everything her way....I havent gotten there. Some things are easier to train out than others. She has no dominance issues around me, I wont tolerate it, but she does have dominance issues with other dogs, and small children. so for everyones safety, she is not allowed off leash. It's not fair to assume that nothing has been done to resolve your dogs issues...in my case lots have been done, and the issues remain.
Once the early socialization period has been lost, it takes much longer to
retrain.

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[quote name='Doglistener']After reading you posts on dog parks I think your problems are training, socialisation and acclimatisation. You can't blame the parks for that, only the owners and some manically aggressive dogs[/quote]

I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "maniacally aggressive", as very few people (if any) here have dogs which I would see as falling under that term.

None of our 5 dogs would fair well at the dog park, and two of them are your "typical" long fuse, non-dog aggressive dog. They will not, however, tolerate harassment from another dog for long than a few seconds, and I see turning them loose with a bunch of strange dogs as a huge opportunity for something to get them fluffed up. It only takes one bad experience or in some cases, "good" experience to screw up years of socialization and training, and that to me isn't worth it. Our dogs play amongst themselves, have controlled socialization with other dogs, and some of them have off-leash play time with other compatable dogs who I know to be "safe" for my dogs to play with (and whos owners I know to be competent enough to handle their dogs).

It's also interesting to note that from the stories I've heard, most dog park fights occur when a dog who "isn't normally like this" is pushed to the point that they retaliate against another dog. I certainly wouldn't call that maniacal aggression. It also seems to go against nature (if we are to believe that dogs are still close to wolves, etc temperaments) that a bunch of strange dogs (some of whom would already be with their own "packs") would all get along fine with each other.

[quote]I see it every day, day in day out. Dogs are friendly and they go to a dog on a lead.[/quote]
Are we talking in a dog park type situation, or in a walk around the neighborhood situation? If a dog park situation, I can understand that sentiment, as it really makes a dog vulnerable for it to be the only dog trapped (on-leash) amongst others off-leash, but if in respect to walks through neighborhoods, etc (which is what I think Mei-Mei was referring to, though I could be wrong), then I absolutely do not agree. Just as people do not always want strange people coming up and trying to talk to them, jumping on them, pulling at their clothes and the like, some dogs simply do not like being harassed by others. Once a dog has been assaulted (which is what it basically is in some cases) by a few overly "friendly" dogs, they probably are going to be fed up with it and take to the offensive by warning them off beforehand.

I don't care how friendly someone's dog is, if they cannot keep it under control and have the common courtesy to ask someone if their dog can "meet" their dog, they shouldn't have it off-leash where there may be other dogs. I feel the same whether I'm walking one of our dog aggressive dogs OR one of the non-dog aggressive dogs who are fine meeting other dogs. I don't feel that it is the dog's fault (and would never kick away or otherwise hurt a dog that was not aggressing at me or my own), but rather the owners. I WILL call to someone with an off-leash dog to get their dog on-leash if I have a dog who will take issue with the dog's antics, but I'm aware that my dogs can feel my actions, and attempt to keep my reactions at a minimum whenever possible. Much better to cue a dog off by yelling and have them get a bit antsy the next time they see a dog than to have a scrap because the other dog wasn't what it seemed when it got up to your dog.

I have absolutely NO problem with people who let their dogs off-lead, keep them under control and out of my dogs' personal space unless I give permission for them to "visit", but people who cannot control their dogs, rather yelling "he's friendly!" or the like as the dog runs up and dives all over one of mine (or worse yet, turns out to NOT be so friendly) are the bane of the dog owning population. The same goes for people with dogs on leash who let their dogs drag them along for the ride as they do what they want.

On dog parks in general, I think there are some dogs that are fine, others that are not. It's up to the owner to be responsible in deciding which their dog is, and unfortunately, many are not, which is a shame because it puts sensible dog owners and their pets at risk.

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