PETA's filed a complaint against Westminster KC

[gooeydog]

For "encouraging" mutilation in the form of tail docking.
[url]http://www.peta.org/feat/dogshow/[/url]
A copy of the complaint is on the right, click the link.

[abker17]

Oh good God. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: I get so sick of hearing Peta scream animal abuse at every little thing. :roll: :-?
I don't think tail docking is wrong. Ear cropping, that's a bit of a different story, but tail docking, I don't see as a problem. Dogs tails use to be docked for working purposes and it was ok then. And I doubt that responsible breeders don't use some sort of pain killer when having the pup's tails docked. What a bunch of BS. :roll: :-? But normal for Peta....... :roll:

[courtnek]

while I would not personally dock a dog, I dont show...and I dont see the point...I would not do anything to support PETA...you let them slide on this issue as being "feeling"...and they;ll get to slide on all their other issues...like putting posters in colleges that say "drink BEER, not MILK"...

[schippsmom]

:Dog_run:

I didn't look at what PETA had on there, I don't want them to think that people are interested in their web site. I don't really care for docking an animal, Re-Run was docked and I wish he wasn't, he would of had a beautiful tail.

Anyway, my brother lives in the D.C. area and every year they have a festival in the harbor that includes selling seafood. PETA was there and decided to buy all the lobster, they were live lobster. So after they spent tons of money, which had been donated, they decided to put the lobsters back in the ocean. That was nice. A few days later dead lobsters started to wash up on shore near where they released the lobsters. Those morons forgot to take the rubber bands off their claws before they released them. I can't imagine what those poor lobsters went through before they finally died. But, that's PETA for you.

Paula & Re-Run

[DogPaddle]

I personally would like to see and end of cropping, and any docking that is strictly aesthetic (I understand some dogs injure their tails and some hunter's claim that docking helps for feild work - I personally have no experience here so I will go with those who know.)
Now as for bringing a complaint against Westminster KC - I think that's just dumb. First of all if you want to convince people to make a change you don't do it by filing a complaint against them, you do it by discussion and offering info - between two peer groups who are both concerned about the issue. Second PETA should really be starting with the gross abuses of animals, changing laws to make penalties stronger etc. :roll:

[Horsefeathers!]

So where does one go to file a complaint against PETA? *mutter* :x

[kendalyn]

[quote]A few days later dead lobsters started to wash up on shore near where they released the lobsters. Those morons forgot to take the rubber bands off their claws before they released them.[/quote]

Well that was stupid! I hope someone let them know in case they try to "save" the lobsters again!

[imported_nea]

:evil: :evil: :evil: I hate PETA! :x While I don't perticuarly like docking and cropping (and I don't know nearly enough aobut it to have a strong opinion) filing complaints agians Westmister is just plain rediculous. :roll:

[imported_Kat]

I am against docking, unless it is a true working dog, but PETA would need to target every single KC in the world to change the regulations. With their track record, I can't see them being taken very seriously :roll:

[imported_Cassie]

Maybe PETA should be waiting around human hospitals and stopping all human male infants from being circumcised as well... :lol:
I have watched a few litters of pups being docked...its not a pretty sight...but, they only do it to pup's between the age of 3 - 5 days old...no older than that...I firmly disagree with an adult dog getting a late tail dock...that is considered amputation....when you think of all the breeds which get their tails docked still its amazing...from Cocker Spaniels, Weimaraner's, Standard Schnauzer, Pembroke Welsh Corgi's, all sizes of Poodles, Yorshire Terrier...alot of terriers...its amazing how many breeds go through this process all for the sack of looks. I'm with every one else, if it is a case of working then by all means have the tail docked to prevent injury...but, just for looks...then it should not be done.

If PETA really wanted to catch some acts of cruelity at the dogs shows they should have hung around the owners of the losers...I can't count how many times at a show I have seen people yelling at their dog for losing a conformation class, throwing it in the crate then kicking the crate...or the poor little poodles left in a head brace for most of the day while the owner scissors its head...goes to do some thing else...leaves the poor little thing on the table for hours and hours in the head brace...the Standard poodles left on tables standing on the noose for hours of the day. Dogs being yelled at due to messing up their coats...the many show dogs which do not lead a normal doggy life and are left in kennels...alot of breeders find that the dogs enjoy the show much more this way as they are just so excited to get out of the kennel for awhile.

[kendalyn]

[quote]or the poor little poodles left in a head brace for most of the day while the owner scissors its head...goes to do some thing else...leaves the poor little thing on the table for hours and hours in the head brace...the Standard poodles left on tables standing on the noose for hours of the day.[/quote]


Can't the people running the show do something about this? I don't know anything about dog shows, but it would seem like they could have a few people wandering around just to make sure the dogs are being treated fairly.

[imported_Cassie]

[quote]Can't the people running the show do something about this? I don't know anything about dog shows, but it would seem like they could have a few people wandering around just to make sure the dogs are being treated fairly.[/quote]
kendalyn, nothing is done...for the most part its quite the norm. I have seen some things done at dog shows which I found very cruel. Every one is so busy making/keeping their dog beautiful they really don't care what the person at the next table is doing. I have been going to the shows for over 20 years...and I have seen some pretty disturbing things done to the poor dogs.

[Guest Anonymous]

*Deleted*

[Guest Anonymous]

I HATE PETA so much, UGH!!!

SexxieRacerChik - I have read numberous times about the experiences owners have gone through with Cropping ears. The seems bleed, and ooze, and the dog is scratching so it needs a head colar. While I LOVE the look of the AmStaff with cropped ears, I don't think I could have the heart to crop mine's (if I had one) ears. It's just too much for the owner and dog to go through, is it really worth it all just for looks?!?!

That is HORRIBLE about the lobsters! What bloody IDIOTS!! :crazyeyes: There has GOT to be SOME way to file a complaint against PETA, I bet it would go over well concidering there's SO many pet owners out there who HATE PETA :evil: :evil: :drinking:

[Guest Anonymous]

[url]http://purebredpuppy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7983&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0[/url]

Prime example of why Cropping is just not worth it :(

While don't think it's worth it (Docking is sometimes, like mentioned previously here) I think PETA should look for some bigger fish to fry, and like Cassie brought up, the way some people treat their dogs at shows :evil: I had no idea that stuff was going on and am appauled, yet not completly shocked. That's just too sad, the lengths some people will go through to win in competing with dogs, it really takes the fun out of it :(

[courtnek]

I have to believe, with all the stupid/moronic/idiotic things that PETA has done, they must have friends in high places....anyone else who had done that to the lobsters would have been arrested for animal cruelty. But they donate money to political campaigns and lobbyist groups, so they are "protected" from the laws other people have to obey...it's all politics....

[Guest Anonymous]

*Deleted*

[dogsgalore]

Personally, I would rather not crop or dock a dog if it was going to be just a pet, not show or working. I think the pitbulls look much cuter with their ears uncropped. :)

[imported_Cassie]

One thing I will agree with which dogsgalore mentioned...a dog with uncropped, undocked tail "look" gentle. I owned a purebred Dobie years ago with tail and ears done...people would take extra precautions before approacing her even though her stub tail was wagging so hard it was funny...the cropped ears and docked tail made her look macho.. :-? if that explains it! :lol: now, my current Dobie mix...which looks more dobie than any thing...has natural ears and a long long long tail...he looks like a goofy cartoon dog :lol: now with him even though he is Dobie (has all the same traits as a Dobie such as check stuck to your check when driving, trying to get as close to owner as is physically possible etc.) people are not intimidated by him in the least...mothers will let their children run up to him (which I do not approve off) before they would let them see my Newfoundland dogs...because he is just so darn cute with the au natural look.
Now, my Rottie on the other hand has the docked tail...people will move to the other side of the street to avoid having to walk past her...yet, a friend of mine has a Rottie which did not have its tail done, people do not think twice about coming up to see him and they will pat him.
I find some times the docked tails and cropped ears can make some breeds look mean...and I was reading an interesting article about human aggression in dogs...it mentioned that the fearful responses of people to a perceived aggressive breed "teaches" the dog to be aggressive with people. As the dog walks the streets, some people, almost imperceptibly, will take a step back or away from the dog. In time the dog can become aggressive toward people. I thought that was pretty interesting.

[kendalyn]

That's really interesting Cassie. It's sort of a self fulfilling prophecy. The dog looks aggressive, so people treat it as if it is aggressive and then it actually becomes more aggressive than it would have otherwise. Yeah, I can see how that can happen.

[imported_Cassie]

I just want to add...this is not a rule that just because some people show fear of a dog...it does not mean the dog is going to turn on humans... :lol: but, it does make sense that it can help push a dog into becoming a bit of a bully...heck, if I was walking down a street with chains and leather and every one avoided walking past me...I'd get a little bit full of myself as well and think I was pretty darn tough...its the nature of the beast...survival of the fittest.
With my Rottie, she LOVES people...but, with fearful people she can be a little bit of a dominant creature...they pick on fear...but, if a person is confident and walks boldy up to my Rottie, she will get very excited and almost wiggle out of her skin with excitement.

[Lucky Chaos]

PETA definatly have somthing wrong in their heads. :roll:

I like the cropped look myself, but would never do it to a puppy. Plus is it really worth the risk? If you take a look at Shara's link there was more then one person, I think 3 or 4 that had a puppy die.

[courtnek]

[quote name='Cassie']I just want to add...this is not a rule that just because some people show fear of a dog...it does not mean the dog is going to turn on humans... :lol: but, it does make sense that it can help push a dog into becoming a bit of a bully...heck, if I was walking down a street with chains and leather and every one avoided walking past me...I'd get a little bit full of myself as well and think I was pretty darn tough...its the nature of the beast...survival of the fittest.
With my Rottie, she LOVES people...but, with fearful people she can be a little bit of a dominant creature...they pick on fear...but, if a person is confident and walks boldy up to my Rottie, she will get very excited and almost wiggle out of her skin with excitement.[/quote]

actually, it is very true...and has been medically researched for a long time. People, like all animals, give off pheremones. Most people think of sex and mating when they hear that word, but actually the "smell of fear" is also a pheremone...and dogs react instinctively to pheremones. Smelling fear may well make them aggressive...it has been said that;s why a normally docile dog will become protective around a burglar or
attacker...the attacker will always have a certain amount of fear
in that situation. So yea, I beleive it's possible.

[Guest Anonymous]

That's so interesting... Cassie, Court, do you have sources i could check out for more info on that?

Luckers - not only a few, but I've been following that forum for a while now, and have heard about two other cases where the cropping has gone wrong, that's the first I've heard of the puppy actually dying, but the other's where it's just gone wrong and one of the owners said she was begining to regret getting her dog cropped. I started a thread on there after reading this and that story of the puppy dying, so far there's a lot of people who think it's not worth taking all the chances, but a few who say that they no doubtly prefer the cropped look. So it's all in a matter of opinion, finding a good vet you trust, and how your dogs ears look. I personally think if I got a AmStaff who's ears were wonky, like totally everywhere and just looked mangled, I'd concider getting them cropped, but even Coal has goofy ears, but I love his ears, wouldn't change a thing. Sometimes one will go triangular like a lab, and the other stays all floppy and it's adorible, other times their both just stuck out to the side or fold over behind, and i think it's adorible. But I've seen some dogs who's ears take over their whole head!! :o

[courtnek]

well, I dont have anything concrete. What I said was from things I have read and seen on TV..there is a website that makes a slight mention of dogs being able to "smell" fear, but either I'm seatching under the wrong category, or I'm not wording it right...

[url]http://www.wcsscience.com/nose/page.html[/url]