Mixed Breed crop/dock

[imported_Kat]

yes Kendalyn and some of those docked dogs are in the thousands of dogs quota that die every day. People butcher them and do botched jobs so add those dogs to the thousands dying.

[kendalyn]

[quote name='Kat']some of those docked dogs are in the thousands of dogs quota that die every day. People butcher them and do botched jobs so add those dogs to the thousands dying.[/quote]

I believe I specifically said those that are docked by a vet.

[quote name='Kendalyn']Who really cares if some are docked or cropped [b]by a vet [/b]at the request of the owner?[/quote]

There's no harm in discussing it at all, but wasting time trying to stop it is just that. A waste of time. :wink:

[Guest Mutts4Me]

Okay, so I don't like cropping and docking, especially when it's done for aesthetic reasons (which cropping usually is). But at least when a purebred is cropped/docked, it is done with some purpose, reason, or excuse, in that the breed standard calls for it, it's for health concerns, the breed is better recognized/adoptable when done, etc.

But I see the cutting up of mixed breed dogs as a big deal because there is no excuse; it is merely for looks. The owner thinks it would look "cool," and since the dog is their property, they can have it cut up however they'd like. <-- When people argue like that, I have to hope that it never becomes "cool" to have three legged dogs, you know?

[DogPaddle]

Nice post Rowie.

[drjeffrock]

I have seen a couple pits literally split their tails from this so-called "happy-tail" syndrome. In such an extreme case, I could understand docking a tail. However, cropping a mixed breeds ears is like those fools that put those big spoilers on their little Honda Civics... Its pointless, like a Honda Civic is fast enough to become airborne without that extra down-force.

[DogPaddle]

Sorry to sidetrack but you have no idea how many times I have thought or said something like this myself:

[quote]like those fools that put those big spoilers on their little Honda Civics[/quote]
:lol:

I have a Honda Civic. It doesn't even have a 5th gear. It is slow and scrapes bottom if you put 4 adults in it and go over bumps. It is powder blue (old lady colour) - all Hondas should be powder blue it suites them. On the up side mine is 16 years old . . . only another 4 years to go and it will technically be a "classic" - at least for emission test standards. :lol:

[Rowie-the-Pooh]

[quote name='Mutts4Me']Okay, so I don't like cropping and docking, especially when it's done for aesthetic reasons (which cropping usually is). But at least when a purebred is cropped/docked, it is done with some purpose, reason, or excuse, in that the breed standard calls for it, it's for health concerns, the breed is better recognized/adoptable when done, etc.

But I see the cutting up of mixed breed dogs as a big deal because there is no excuse; it is merely for looks. The owner thinks it would look "cool," and since the dog is their property, they can have it cut up however they'd like. <-- When people argue like that, I have to hope that it never becomes "cool" to have three legged dogs, you know?[/quote]
My thoughts [i]exactly[/i]! HOW do you do that? :lol:
[quote]Nice post Rowie.[/quote]
Thanks!

[drjeffrock]

[quote name='DivineOblivion19'][quote name='drjeffrock']I have seen a couple pits literally split their tails from this so-called "happy-tail" syndrome. In such an extreme case, I could understand docking a tail. However, cropping a mixed breeds ears is like those fools that put those big spoilers on their little Honda Civics... Its pointless, like a Honda Civic is fast enough to become airborne without that extra down-force.[/quote]

[color=indigo]Excellent post Jeff!!!!! :lol: I hate it when I see a Civic with the giant aluminum spoiler!!!![/color] :cunao: :cunao: :cunao: :cunao: :cunao:[/quote]
LOL, I have a couple friends in Garden Grove and its insane there. Every freaking Civic looks like a rolling discotheque. Dont get me wrong, I used to be deep in the import scene, but I just never understood certain things. Here's another, people who put those monster-tach shift lights on their cars. You know, the big huge tachometer on the left that lights up after you hit a certain rpm? I havve actually seen idiots put them on automatic cars. :roll:

[kendalyn]

[quote name='Mutts4Me']But I see the cutting up of mixed breed dogs as a big deal because there is no excuse; it is merely for looks.[/quote]

But it's the same in purebred dogs such as Dobermans or Pit Bulls. Those crops have no real excuse and are also only for looks. Why is it wrong to take a mutt to the vet and have it's ears cropped? It's not like the Doberman couldn't live just fine with its natural ears. :roll:

I would personally never choose to crop or dock any dog, but I think it's ridiculous to get all up in arms about someone cropping a mutt and then saying it's OK to crop a purebred.

Is it ok to crop a purebred lab? Or what about those gigantic keg on legs pit bulls that are obviously mutts passed off as purebreds. Is it OK to crop those, or is that wrong too? I mean, technically they are mutts right?

As long as it's done by a vet, I don't see a problem with it.

[hicksstar]

Well first off having had docked breeds over the past 15 years (Dobe, Rotties, Bull dogs) it is something that here in Australia we are going to have to get used to. (Having natrual tails that is) Not sure about all states but in most if not all it is against the law for a vet to dock tails, croping hasnt been done here for as long as I know???? However anyone that has a litter of puppies can chop of there tails themself. HOW WRONG IS THIS?
In my last litter I had 10 pups and 5 had natraul short tails and 5 had long. 1 that had a natraul short tail (it was like 3/4 with a huge kink) Was docked by our vet as it could have caused problems sitting ect.
Dont quote me on this one as I am not sure wheather this is right.
The standard of docked breeds in australia has changed to include there natural tails and as of last year if you sell a pup to be shown it must have natural tail. So the only people docking tails in Australia are people selling pups that either are not registered or are not to be shown and vets only docking for health reasons.
Please correct me if I am wrong. :wink:

[courtnek]

[quote name='drjeffrock'][quote name='DivineOblivion19'][quote name='drjeffrock']I have seen a couple pits literally split their tails from this so-called "happy-tail" syndrome. In such an extreme case, I could understand docking a tail. However, cropping a mixed breeds ears is like those fools that put those big spoilers on their little Honda Civics... Its pointless, like a Honda Civic is fast enough to become airborne without that extra down-force.[/quote]

[color=indigo]Excellent post Jeff!!!!! :lol: I hate it when I see a Civic with the giant aluminum spoiler!!!![/color] :cunao: :cunao: :cunao: :cunao: :cunao:[/quote]
LOL, I have a couple friends in Garden Grove and its insane there. Every freaking Civic looks like a rolling discotheque. Dont get me wrong, I used to be deep in the import scene, but I just never understood certain things. Here's another, people who put those monster-tach shift lights on their cars. You know, the big huge tachometer on the left that lights up after you hit a certain rpm? I havve actually seen idiots put them on automatic cars. :roll:[/quote]


OMD Jeff I am splitting my sides!!! I hate those things....what in the world does one needs a spoiler, or even a wing, for on a car that doesnt sit 6 inches off the ground? I have a New Beetle..they sell those with spoilers and wings too...why? the original beetle was lucky if it could do 60 mph....

and even the new ones arent speed demons....

[Rowie-the-Pooh]

[quote name='kendalyn'][quote name='Mutts4Me']But I see the cutting up of mixed breed dogs as a big deal because there is no excuse; it is merely for looks.[/quote]

But it's the same in purebred dogs such as Dobermans or Pit Bulls. Those crops have no real excuse and are also only for looks. Why is it wrong to take a mutt to the vet and have it's ears cropped? It's not like the Doberman couldn't live just fine with its natural ears. :roll:

I would personally never choose to crop or dock any dog, but I think it's ridiculous to get all up in arms about someone cropping a mutt and then saying it's OK to crop a purebred.

Is it ok to crop a purebred lab? Or what about those gigantic keg on legs pit bulls that are obviously mutts passed off as purebreds. Is it OK to crop those, or is that wrong too? I mean, technically they are mutts right?

As long as it's done by a vet, I don't see a problem with it.[/quote]

I don't know about the others, but the way I see it its wrong to crop/dock pedigrees (IMO) and always felt grateful that mixes didn't have to face it. The reason I see a problem with it is that now even mixes have to face it, which means more cropping/docking with dogs in general. Another thing is, theres absolutely [b]no[/b] reason to crop/dock the do (the mix), why make it suffer? Unless for medical reasons, theres no point whatsoever.

Did y'all know that they used to dock HORSES' tails? Its illegal now, but I can't imagine horses without their beautiful, silky tails!

[Guest Mutts4Me]

[quote name='kendalyn'][quote name='Mutts4Me']But I see the cutting up of mixed breed dogs as a big deal because there is no excuse; it is merely for looks.[/quote]

But it's the same in purebred dogs such as Dobermans or Pit Bulls. Those crops have no real excuse and are also only for looks. [/quote]

I can't argue with you there, because I don't really like Cropping at all, purebred or not. But at least there's some kind of reason for doing purebred with cropping in their standards, valid or not. Several Dobe people will tell you that it's a proven fact that if a Dobe is in a shelter, it is much more likely to get adopted if it's cropped, because people don't recognize it for what it is with natural ears. Other breeds get done for similar reasons, I suppose, and others for tradition or whatever.

[quote]I would personally never choose to crop or dock any dog, but I think it's ridiculous to get all up in arms about someone cropping a mutt and then saying it's OK to crop a purebred. [/quote]

First, I don't think anyone's all up in arms. I posted about something I thought was odd, that's all. I don't sit at home and worry about poor cropped and docked Sadie, the little mutt. I do sit at home and worry about the RottX puppy next door who gets tied out in the snow and has recently begun breaking free and chasing cars. And secondly, I never said I thought it was okay to crop a purebred, I merely said that at least when it's done to a purebred, there's some kind of reasoning for it.

[quote]Is it ok to crop a purebred lab? [/quote]

Err, no... The purebreds I'm talking about are the ones who have it in their standards to be cropped. I think cropping a mixed breed is about the equivilant of cropping a purebred that's never been cropped, like a Labrador. It's stupid and without basis.

[quote]As long as it's done by a vet, I don't see a problem with it.[/quote]

So do you think it's okay for someone to cut off a Labrador's ears, as long as it's done by a vet? A Cocker? Beagle? Weimaraner?


BTW, I think part of the reason no one's been yelling "cropping is bad" in purebreds (maybe why you think we're saying it's okay) is because I asked in the beginning that this not be turned into a debate about whether cropping/docking was "okay" or not, and I've been really impressed with everyone's willingness to limit themselves in that regard.

[kendalyn]

[quote name='Mutts4Me']So do you think it's okay for someone to cut off a Labrador's ears, as long as it's done by a vet? A Cocker? Beagle? Weimaraner?[/quote]

yeah, as long as its done by a vet and there isn't something about the ears that would make a crop a problem for the dog. Cockers and Beagles have such long ears I guess I'd want the vet to make sure it wouldn't hurt them in the long run to have them cropped.

I would never crop any dog ever, but as long as it is legal its really no different than cropping any other breed.

[Lucky Chaos]

So let me ask this. What if you have a mix of two breeds that are normally cropped/docked? Like a boxer/dobe mix for example. Its in both standards, so is it okay then? Or not?

[__crazy_canine__]

I agree with Kendalyn on this actually. I mean, purebred or not I wouldnt crop/dock my dog but... why should being purebred be a valid excuse to crop/dock a dog? I know some of you might bring the whole docking and balance thing into play but a lot of purebreds are just for show/pet quality not work, especially in America.

I dont have a problem with a vet cropping/docking a mix or purebreed. Just, like I said, its not something I would do...

[odnarb]

[quote name='courtnek']I've heard that before, that dogs with tails like that dock them to prevent injury. I believe its called "Happy Tail" from being banged into doors and walls (and legs)

this is why I disagree with that reasoning. Labs have "happy tails", and can clear a coffee table in a fell swoop. in fact, the breed standard lists the tail as one of the things the dog is tobe judged on. if should be strong, thick, straight and otterlike, and able to clear a table with one sweep. I am NOT making this up. its in the breed standard.
rarely do you ever see labs with docked tails, unless it had to be done due to injury.

next, my hound also has happy tail. and I have the bruises on my legs to attest to it. when she bangs her tail into a door or wall it will wake you up from a heavy sleep. no kidding. yet you rarely ever see foxhounds with docked tails either.[/quote]


Foxhounds and Labs have thicker tails. It makes a difference. Next time Brando wags his tail into hamburger, I'll be sure to post pics. Whenever it happens, it starts a cycle of keeping his tail bandaged for MONTHS until it heals. It's not pretty.

My addition to the thread, I once saw a litter of docked GSD/Ridgeback mixes. Very odd, neither breed is normally docked... :o