Attacks

[abker17]

Sorry for any spelling mistakes, I'm shaking so bad right now. Abby just attacked Cracker, I don't know why. She had her by the neck, and if it wasn't for Crackers' thick fur she might be dead. I'm so upset. Just last Sunday she attacked my friens'd dog, Rivkah. The dog had put a tennis ball by Abby, and Abby wwent to take it when Rivkah was going to pick it up. I managed to get them apart, and they were both fine. Cracker is sitting in the pantry right now shaking. :cry: :cry: :cry: I can't let this happen again. What should I do? God, I'm so upset. I love Abby so much, but she's going to hurt Cracker one of these days. Cracker is very submissive and only fights back to try to get Abby off of her. These are not just squabbles. It's horrible! :x :cry: :x :-? Abby is locked in the bathroom right now... where she'll stay for a while. A LONG WHILE. Please help me. I'm starting Abby in agility and if she happened to do this to a dog that I didn't know... we could be sued. HELP PLEASE!

[Guest Anonymous]

Abker, I'm so sorry that I don't have any advice for you. I'm sure that more knowledgeable people here will be able to give you some good advice. I can only imagine what you're going through. Just hang in there. Is this out of the ordinary for her? Maybe you should call her vet?

[abker17]

She's always been very dominant and jeolus, a attention hog. My mom said before she left for the grocery store she saw Abby eating Cracker's food. She's a little pig, so that was not strange. Moments after my mom left they started fighting. I don't know how, but Cracker managed to escape to the bathroom. Abby was still attacking her the whole way though. She's gotten Cracker before, fight ing over food. I think that is what happened, though I find it very strange that Cracker would even challenge Abby. Cracker might of just gotten to close and Abby felt that her food was threatened (Abby had already eaten :roll: ) I'm starting stricter food feeding from now on. Right after I finish dinner, Cracker will be fed while Abby is another room. She will have about 15 min to eat, before her food is taken up and put away. Then Abby's turn, same thing 15 min. Cracker goes outside to do her business while Abby eats. In the morning, same schedule. I have another question though, I usually let Abby sleep in bed with me. Should I keep her locked in the bathroom over night, or let her sleep in my room, just not on the bed? :-?

[Guest Anonymous]

I've heard that letting your dog sleep in bed with you can make them more dominant than they already are because they then feel they are on the same level with you. I could be wrong it's just something that I've been told by other dogs owners who have more experience than I do. I think your idea of seperate meal time is a good idea. I crate my dogs to feed them. That way the only food they can eat is their own. If you have crates for your dogs that might be a good way to go also. I be thinking of you and Abby and Cracker. I'm sure that someone with more experience will be able to help more than I can. Hang in there.

[pei obssessed]

First thing: I don't have any experience with this... but fom what I've read, it sounds to me like Abby is dominant not only with Cracker--a simple "no" or "stop it" from you didn't stop her behaviour, did it? So I think you shouldn't allow her in bed with you anymore so that she understands that sheis not your equal, you are always right, she must always obey you immediately, and only humans distribute food, SHE DOESN'T! Other than that, I can't offer much advice, because as I said, I didn't deal personally with this problem. But some other people here might be of more help... Good luck to you.

[abker17]

Thank You so much Bentleysmom! Your kind words mean alot. The reason Abby sleeps with me is a long story. When I was younger I suffered from mild cases of insomnia. I would sometimes sit up and cry till the early hours of the morning because I couldn't get to sleep. When I did get to sleep I would wake up at around 2:00 in the morning and not be able to go back to sleep for about another two hours. Soon I started slepping with the light on, then the t.v. Soon I was sleeping on the floor by the hall way so I could see what was coming easily. I jumped at every noise, I was terrified. I don't know of what, but I was always scared. Cracker would not come to sleep with me, so at night I sat alone in my room terrified of something, I don't even know what. Then I got Abby. She slept with me and I felt protected. I felt safe. My fear melted away and I could sleep. Now I'm crying, god it feels good to tell someone this. I still slept with the light and t.v. on, but slowly the insomnia went away. Then just last summer we moved. I slept with the light off for the first time in 4 yrs. Abby always slept with me, and if she got on the floor I would toss and turn and not be able to sleep. So U see I need Abby very much. She gave me back something I thought for sure I had lost.
Thanks for letting me ramble, it feels so good to tell some one.

[abker17]

And thank U pie-obsessed too. We most have posted at the same time cause I didn't read yours till just now.

[pei obssessed]

Hmmm... I just read your post, and in your case, I'd do away with the "dog no sleeping in bed" rule :D Let's just hope that somebody on the forum has some more useful suggestions than mine :lol:

apropos of my suggestion, there is a Romanian saying--"do as the preacher does, not as the preacher preaches" :lol: and this is what the preacher does... that's me sleeping under Hippo's paws! :lol:
[img]http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0QwC0BEcUWLMnBbKCWngxMAvHWRwJ603DbeXJ!Uwn4Wi7l808QvWGUCOPvHB1nD!YT9x4JZgBSXtQsYZhProfY9NYO7Ac0s!AgLNIQN!!80M/9_months_3.jpg?dc=4675425646350272292[/img]

[Guest Anonymous]

I know how you feel about the insomnia. I suffer from it also. I can certainly understand why having Abby sleep with you helps. You're kind of inbetween a rock and a hard place with this one. Maybe you could again try to sleep with Abby sleeping in your room but on the floor. Another thing I would suggest is for you to go see your doctor. A lot of people think that insomnia really isn't that big of a deal, but I know just how stressful it really is. I can certainly sympathize with you on that aspect. But your doctor maybe able to help you with your sleeping problems. Like I stated before I can only imagine what your going through. Just know that I'll certainly be here to talk to. As is everyone else here at Dogo. As my mother used to say to me...Hang in there and keep your chin up! You, Abby and Cracker will be in my thoughts and prayers.

[courtnek]

Abker. DEMOTE HER!! she thinks she is top dog. If you allow her to continue she will give YOU issues.... she is trying to claim her place in the household as top dog under you. WHO should be top dog? Is she the best, strongest, mOST CAPABLE? SHOULD she be top dog? In most cases, the dogs will work it out themselves...if they fight about it, you might need to decide, to keep the peace...let me know how it goes.....I will help you.

PM me if ypu need help...

[Guest Anonymous]

I know you've posted that Abby is a BC mix, do you know what the other part of the mix is? From the pic of her in the pictures section, she looks like she's maybe part Akita (that's just something I think might be possible from that pic, I'm probably wrong), and if she is, that would help explain why she's acting this way.

I know some people won't agree with this, but here's my thoughts on all this. Unless she's shown dominance towards you, I wouldn't worry too much about that right now. All of our dogs have their little spats now and then (most of the ones Annie's gotten into recently result in at least one bleeding dog, and need to be physically broken up), yet none of them would dream of challenging one of us people. So, unless she's giving you a reason to doubt her trustworthyness around you, then I say let her keep sleeping with you. You CAN keep her in her place though by only letting her up on the bed/furniture when you call her up, and making her get down anytime you get up for something.

In the meantime, keep all resources up while you work with her on her guarding issues... only give toys/chewies/food when you're there to supervise, make her do obedience to earn them, and trade them away in exchange for a treat when you want them back. Has anything happened to make her so guardy about "her" things lately? Have you decreased her exercise or the amount of attention she gets or anything like that? Do you notice any particular times when she does this more often? During/right after exercise or other "high stress" times?

I disagree with the idea that a dog who's in the heat of a fight and doesn't come out on command is acting out of dominance... MOST dogs won't stop fighting on a simple command, hence all those ideas for breaking up fights (water hoses, pepper, choking, etc).

[gooeydog]

Above post was me :oops:

[Bubblezzz]

abker, sorry I can't offer any advice, but hang in there!!


pei obsessed, just HAVE to say, that is an absolutely ADORABLE picture of you and Hippo!!! :sleep: :sleep2: :sheep:

[abker17]

Thanks everyone for your replies. Gooeydog, I agree with U. Abby has never tried to really be dominant over me. She lets me walk through doors first, and if I say move she promptly moves. She gives me her food and toys if I want them and I really don't think she's trying to dominant over me.
We've all had a lot of stress this week, I have final exams and have been worring a lot. Maybe she can sense that I'm tense and worried. Also, we do think she has some akita in her. If U look at her face U can see it. Plus, she has a curl in her tail. I don't know if this has anything to do with it, but last weekend and Mon. she had diareha and threw up. She seems fine now.
She's been getting the same amount of exercise, food, training time, nothing's really changed.
Bentleysmom, I've already been to see a doctor about the insomnia. He suggested listening to soothing sounds, like birds. :roll: That didn't work. He gave me no other options. He didn't think the insomnia was bad enough for medication.
Thanks everyone, you've made me feel a lot better, and thanks for the pic of your cutie, pie-obsessed. :D

[Sanvean]

I would get a professional trainer or behaviorist's advice. He/she might be able to help more than we can. I hope all goes well!

[Carolk9s]

I can't add to the advice already given but I do want to ask you to be VERY careful with Abby when you take her to agility. You MUST talk to your instructor and let them know you have some concerns that Abby 'might' be aggressive under certain circumstances. You MUST be proactive on this one, do not let Abby offleash if she shows aggression towards ANY other dog in the class. She is your responsibility. Your instructor might decide that private instruction before going into a group situation is best for Abby so she can learn in a less stressful environment.
Candy was attacked twice by an English Shepherd in her first agility class, the second time it happened Candy was ready to really fight and I had to separate the dogs before either got hurt. I believe this is at least partly why now if another dog so much as mumbles at Candy, she flies in their face ready to fight. It also stresses her to have other dogs snarling at her as she is anticipating an attack.
A dog that is attacked in a learning situation can be ruined for that type of training and affected in other areas as well.
As you said, there is also the legal aspect to be concerned with.
Other than that, there is the other owner aspect. I will NOT stand by while another dog attacks mine, if it's a minor spat that happens once, thats within normal. If it's an aggressive dog coming after mine, I get very angry and defensive too. If this dog is able to come after my dog a second time, the gloves are off and I WILL stop this dog from attacking in one way or another. Please don't take this wrong, I do know little spats will happen and usually no harm done. But no one should stand by and let their dog be attacked and ruined by another.

[Rowie-the-Pooh]

I'm so sorry your going through such a hard time Abker! :cry: I am too, keep your chin up K? :D

[abker17]

Thanks everyone for your advice. I've decided to call the agility instructor and ask her what she thinks is best. I WOULD NOT stand by and let Abby hurt any dog. I will control her as best I can. Oh, I'm so confused! :( :-? :x Abby is not good off leash either... I need to call the instructor. I'll update soon...

[Carolk9s]

Abker,
The agility instructor should be willing to work something out so that Abby can participate in agility training. He/she might suggest some heavy duty attention training first so that Abby will focus on you and ignore the other dogs. It can be done, best of luck to you and keep us updated!

[DogPaddle]

Sanvean - Excellent advice.

Gooey mentioned the problem might have something to do with the part Akita bit and that Abby was also a BC cross. I know next to nothing about Akitas but BCs can alos be a bit chippy as well, I think it has to do with their control issues. Kavik does seem to need to be "in control" of the other animals in the house, thankfully he draws the line there and only trys to cajole and con the people in the house into doing what he wants. Some of Kavik's issues were improved by taking him to obedience class (always on leash.) This was not so much to do with the obedience itself (although anything that gives Kavik a set roll or task calms him down) but with being around other dogs in a safe environment and not being "in control."