Guest Anonymous Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Here are the pics! This was a mild one. :cry: :cry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest roo Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Oh poor little man, it is so unfair :cry: Kiss and hugs to Jac Roo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Oh i wanna cry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Yep....Son just asked me why I took pics of it!! Broke my heart.... :cry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobbit Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Oh my, that is sad. Chili was laying down, like she was fixing to get up (you know, on her belly and chest). She started slapping the floor with her left paw. We went to her to comfort her and she tried to get up, but couldn't. Same dilated pupils, looks like with Jac. No drooling, but jaw clinched. No paddling, because she wasn't on her side. We took her to the vet and ran tests, she is normal as can be. He said if she had another one, we will run more indepth/extensive tests. She will get her Interceptor on Thursday, so, we'll see if she has another one. If she does.....we just found the culprit. Thanks for posting the pictures. The pictures are valuable for future information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 [quote name='Hobbit']Oh my, that is sad. Chili was laying down, like she was fixing to get up (you know, on her belly and chest). She started slapping the floor with her left paw. We went to her to comfort her and she tried to get up, but couldn't. Same dilated pupils, looks like with Jac. No drooling, but jaw clinched. No paddling, because she wasn't on her side. We took her to the vet and ran tests, she is normal as can be. He said if she had another one, we will run more indepth/extensive tests. She will get her Interceptor on Thursday, so, we'll see if she has another one. If she does.....we just found the culprit. Thanks for posting the pictures. The pictures are valuable for future information.[/quote] Guys this dog is one in a million..He is my angel and I am his.... Jac's started kinda like that...He would try to come to us and would moan and look at you and follow you with his eyes... He had thethem more frequent though.. Now he doesn't moan..his jaw is clinched tight..He will try at times to move but not like he did.. He however doesn't have as many..(1 a month sometimes 2*rare*) Lasts longer though.. I am not sure how exactly Interceptor works..If it is a time release deal or what?? If it is a slow release for a week?? I was told once that Jac's tendons were not keeping up with his bones or he had a slipped disc...I have come to the realization that is not the case... Now Jac is scheduled for tests Thurs. and we go from there however I would like to do some more research on the Interceptor before I go...I ask the vets office if they ever had any problems with it and they said nooo. So I am on my own....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobbit Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 We contacted Interceptor and they said, "absolutely it is NOT the Interceptor". Of course, I didn't expect any other response. The lady from Interceptor said it would peak within 12 to 17 hours and be out of their system. I didn't call back to see if I got another person with another answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Here is my thing....Why is it so hard for anyone to believe that maybe just MAYBE one or two times it happens!! I know you test things and you do controls and everything...But you to not test every freaking dog in the country!!!! :x :x The same thing goes with everything else...Okay Iams made Jac vomit like crazy for three days ..Of course they wouldsay it was not their food!!! But that is okay...I do not know sometimes.... Major vent there!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corgilady Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 :o I've missed something here but anyway.....again, LIABILITY. If vets admit meds (THEIR meds that THEY recommended) cause probs then they end up in the middle of lawsuits, court etc....tie up their valuable TIME. A personal anecdote: I had that birth control thingie in my arm....what was it called....they had to do a surgery and it lasted 5 years???? norplant????? about 3 years into it my immune system went bonkers....NOOOOO it can't be the norplant....NOOOOO we have never heard of it before..... finally I was in a chatroom and a girl with a moniker like "angelnurse" PM'd me and said, go to this website....it was full of stories JUST LIKE MINE.... it was too late I was already sick. But this stuff is being swept under the rug. Sounds like the same thing is happening w/ the interceptor? I gotta go back and find the beginning of Jacsmoms story! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 [b][size=7]Hobbit[/b][/size] Okay got attention now! I usually do not read the fine print on labels or the little paper that comes in the bottle but went to the web site for Interceptor searching and looking and this was there.... Adverse Reactions The following adverse reactions have been reported following the use of INTERCEPTOR: Depression/ lethargy, vomiting, ataxia, anorexia, diarrhea, convulsions, weakness and hypersalivation. Efficacy INTERCEPTOR Flavor Tabs eliminate the tissue stage of heartworm larvae and the adult stage of hookworm (Ancylostoma caninum), roundworms (Toxocara canis, Toxascaris leonina) and whipworm (Trichuris vulpis ) infestations when administered orally according to the recommended dosage schedule. The anthelmintic activity of milbemycin oxime is believed to be a result of interference with invertebrate neurotransmission. I am not sure what exactly Jac's thing is but I thought if it didn't help me it might help you!! :wink: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 Milbemycin oxime is a mixture of the A4(80%) and the A3 (20%) oximes of Milbemycin D. Commercial use of is limited to dogs. A dose of 0.5 mg/kg body weight is used, on a monthly basis, to prevent patent infections of Dirofilaria immitis, the canine heartworm. The drug is effective in killing all migrating precardiac stages of D. immitis. It is also effective against adults of Ancylostoma caninum, Trichuris vulpis and Toxocara canis. Idiosyncratic toxic reactions have been observed in rough coated collies at 25 times the normal monthly dosage rate. These reactions included ataxia, pyrexia and periodic recumbency. This is from another place!! :( :o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 These drugs are given monthly (30 days) for the convenience of giving on the same day each month and also to give you a safety margin. If you forget to give your dog his/her heartworm medication, you have about 15 days to remember to give it and the dog will still be protected. With the daily medication, forgetting for more than a day may result in your dog becoming infected. My question would be ...if it is still in the system for that 15 days and you give it on time.... Would the dog have an "overload"?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carolk9s Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 I's confused, I dont see any pictures? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 Yeah I posted them just for a bit.... We took Jac to the vet today for blood work and results will be back tomorrow.. Hobbit...Vet said that he had seen one dog with reaction to Interceptor himself..The reaction occurred within 24-48 hrs of taking the pill... :-? Will update on the blood work... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobbit Posted October 17, 2002 Share Posted October 17, 2002 THANK YOU -- really interested in the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobbit Posted October 17, 2002 Share Posted October 17, 2002 Jacsmom: Hum....funny, because the info sheet in the box says NOTHING about adverse reactions. I'm going to pull up the MSDS sheet on this. Yeah, the 15 day thing bothered me, too. BECAUSE the info person at Norvaris said the drug was out of the dogs system with 24 to 48 hours, usually less. Because it peaked at 12 to 17 hours. SO, my thinking is that of yours (Jacsmom) -- if it's still in the system at 45 days, WHY overlap, overdose, doubledose...etc? Of course, I didn't even expect them to admit anything --- liability would be too great, you're right Corgilady. Some of the homeopathic users, use Black Walnut seed and crushed watermelon seed as a HW preventative. Watermelon seed contains Arsenic, so I can see using it --- the dosage would have to be correct. So much --- can and does hurt your beloved dog, just like your children. How can we possibly protect them - all the time? It's making me weary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 17, 2002 Share Posted October 17, 2002 Sasha I will let you guys know!! Hobbit (I am going to use "dumb" thinging here) if the drug is gone in that amount of time... what is there to keep the heartworm prevention going for 30 days? Or 45? There has to be something in the system..... They cannot tell me there is nothing there!!! :-? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carolk9s Posted October 17, 2002 Share Posted October 17, 2002 My understanding of heartworm meds from my vet is this. The medication does not prevent heartworms, it prevents heartworm disease. The dog can be exposed to heartworms over and over by being bit by an infected mosquito. When we dose the dog with the heartworm meds each month, it KILLS any resident heartworms. This cycle can continue month after month. By killing resident heartworms on a monthly basis, it prevents DISEASE which would result as the heartworms grew and multiplied. I am speaking of heartgard and interceptor here, there may be other meds that act differently. And, if anyone has conflicting info to the above that they can provide with backup, please post it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobbit Posted October 17, 2002 Share Posted October 17, 2002 [quote name='Carolk9s']My understanding of heartworm meds from my vet is this. The medication does not prevent heartworms, it prevents heartworm disease. The dog can be exposed to heartworms over and over by being bit by an infected mosquito. When we dose the dog with the heartworm meds each month, it KILLS any resident heartworms. This cycle can continue month after month. By killing resident heartworms on a monthly basis, it prevents DISEASE which would result as the heartworms grew and multiplied. I am speaking of heartgard and interceptor here, there may be other meds that act differently. And, if anyone has conflicting info to the above that they can provide with backup, please post it.[/quote] Correct, it breaks the cycle --- keeps them from maturing. It's not (supposedly) a residual. It acts more like a purge. Think of it like a window of opportunity. You have the dog tested, it is negative for HW filaria, then....the dog gets bitten by an infected mosquito that same day, the HW cycle starts. The next morning, you give the dog a HW preventative --- it kills the filaria. Now, he may be bitten with an infected mosquito again, but---the life cycle is such that you medicate him before they mature. NOW, what's to keep them (the worms) from becoming resistent to the medication/poison? Think about that one....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 17, 2002 Share Posted October 17, 2002 Okay so you prevent them from reaching maturity..... Why does the site say that it is in the system or rather..... These drugs are given monthly (30 days) for the convenience of giving on the same day each month and also to give you a safety margin. If you forget to give your dog his/her heartworm medication, you have about 15 days to remember to give it and the dog will still be protected. That is where I am lost!! :-? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carolk9s Posted October 17, 2002 Share Posted October 17, 2002 [quote name='Jacsmom']Okay so you prevent them from reaching maturity..... Why does the site say that it is in the system or rather..... These drugs are given monthly (30 days) for the convenience of giving on the same day each month and also to give you a safety margin. If you forget to give your dog his/her heartworm medication, you have about 15 days to remember to give it and the dog will still be protected. That is where I am lost!! :-?[/quote] I'm just guessing here, I imagine Hobbit will have a more reliable answer. I believe the 15 day 'grace' period indicates that any worms present in the dogs system will not have matured to the point of dying and shedding thereby clogging the heart with the time period. Perhaps they are assuming the dog was infected the within a day or two of the previous dose and the worms reach the stage of harmful proportions after 45 days? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 17, 2002 Share Posted October 17, 2002 OK talked to vet..... Carol you are right about the above....15 day thing.... Jac: Thyroid is fine....Liver functions all are fine EXCEPT: he has a high Akaline/Phosphate level...Now here is the tricky part...This can come from his leg healing also...When a bone is healing it will cause a spike in this level....So the vet wants to do another check in 6 months... Until then Phenobaritol for seizures..I can either treat at certain time of the month or all the time..(he has had them first 2 weeks of month(seizures)) Vet also said that if I wanted I could give Jac an Interceptor pill and see if I get a reaction! He said it is possible that could be a problem. He said even if it is not time for a pill it is out of his system in 24-48 hrs and would not hurt him so I would be safe giving him one. He kind of left it up to me. What do you think??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobbit Posted October 18, 2002 Share Posted October 18, 2002 Whew, that is a judgement call. At least you would know (sort of) what is causing the problem. On the other hand, you hate to *INDUCE* the seizures. But....then you'd know. The location where you are at, do you have to medicate 12 months/year? OR, are the winters cold enough to warrant a down time? If so, then during the down time, he should not have a seizure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowie-the-Pooh Posted October 18, 2002 Share Posted October 18, 2002 Oh Jacsmom, sorry to hear that about Jac! :cry: But ince I can't see the pictures, what's exactly wrong with the poor puppy?! :o Poor Jac... :( Best wishes from me and Rowie... 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted October 18, 2002 Share Posted October 18, 2002 [quote name='Hobbit']Whew, that is a judgement call. At least you would know (sort of) what is causing the problem. On the other hand, you hate to *INDUCE* the seizures. But....then you'd know. The location where you are at, do you have to medicate 12 months/year? OR, are the winters cold enough to warrant a down time? If so, then during the down time, he should not have a seizure.[/quote] One year it is cold one year it is not :-? !! That is where I am stuck.. He did say that if it was the Interceptor we could go to the Proheart 6...Well then you here stuff about it... But for ever dog that has a reaction there are 100 that do not.... Well I am going to do some thinking... :-? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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