Seijun

Very interesting... Thanks a lot for the heads up on this. ~Seij

Just said they were drowned at the sewage plant--doesn't necessarily mean raw sewage. If my facts are strait, sewage plants also have water which the dogs could have been drowned in. *shrugs* guess it doesn't really matter though, drowned is drowned. ~Seij

[quote]The product of a male tiger and a female lion mating produces some darn big cats, but they are also sterile or produce weak, short-lived offspring. The product of a male lion and a female tiger is much smaller than either of its parents and again...sterile.[/quote] I know a guy online that has a 3/4 lion, 1/4 tiger mix. I have also seen some long-lived ligers and tigons. [quote]What happens when you hybridize a wolf with a GSD and conform it into a breed standard (e.g. Saarloos Wolfdog)? Is it a wolf (Canis lupus)? No. Is it a dog? It's generally considered so, but how can an animal bred from two converging species still be classified as Canis familiaris? [/quote] Since the wolfdog breeds are no longer part wolf, they are considered "dog." The wolves were introduced only a few times. GSD was added to a much greater extent, and the resulting breeds are far enough removed from the wolf additions that any "wolf" genes they carried are long gone. ~Seij

Errr... I don't get it. Why do you need that thing to tell you who your dog is friends or foes with--wouldn't you know yourself if you were the one taking him out for a walk? I can only see this thing being useful for morons who let their dogs run lose unatended. ~Seij

[quote name='courtnek']I agree with Pyr....maybe break the list up into most common/popular, then less common/popular....then dogs who arent for the average pet owner (I didnt look up every dog type, but wolf-dogs, IMO, would fall into the"not for JPQ category) [/quote] Maybe omit the "average pet owner" idea... If you think about it, many average pet owners probably couldn't handle a lab, if poms were what they were used to and they were unprepared for a large breed dog. Common/popular is something that could be researched, but what dogs are good for what type of owners comes down to opinion too much of the time, and how you define the "average pet owner." If you want to add something about a dog's care level, it might be best to say something like "not [i]reccomended[/i] for beginners." I'm worried that if things end up being grouped into "average pet owner dogs" and "non-average pet owner dogs," it could give some people an automatic sense that a breed listed would be [b]easy[/b] to keep (if it was listed as "for the average pet owner"), if in reality, that breed not be right for them at all. There are too many levels of "average" unfortunately.

[quote]It might be different with really good outdoor facilities, lots of stimulation and other canine company (presumably this is the case with your dogs) [/quote] The two pointers outside share the same kennel. They have toys and shelter that can withstand rain, sleet, snow, etc. and both hot and cold temps (although we will bring them inside to sleep if the weather gets bellow freezing). They are let out to run twice a day, and we often let the indoor pointer (a pup) out to play with them for hours in the kennel. The husky mix is kept to herself because there is not enough room in the other kennel for her, she and the older pointer don't really get along that well, and the younger pointer is afraid of her. Her kennel is also safe from the weather, she has toys, and she is walked twice a day, about an hour to an hour and a half each. If the day is not too hot or wet, we put her out on the cable in the backyard (supervised) so she can stalk squires and play with the indoor pointer when she is let out to run. It is very difficult to find playmates for the husky mix though. She is very territorial and will rarely accept any new dogs except puppies. She will only tolerate a puppy for so long though and we have yet to meet an adult dog that likes her and vice versa. *cringes* sorry for going off topic… ~Seij

Has anyone succeeded in standardizing Labradoodles yet? ~Seij

Sorry, I did not know he was tied to a tree. (Mentioned earlier though that it would be different if he was in a well-built, well-furnished outdoor enclosure). I have never been through a hurricane though. Was the hurricane actually on top of them when the dog was struck, or was it "before the storm" conditions? I understand about not leaving a dog out during hurricane force weather, but if things weren't bad yet, there would be no reason to bring the dog in. Tied to a tree though, yeesh... That's like inviting your dog to get hit even during just "regular" storms. ~Seij

How do you train a husky though if it is an adult and was never house trained ever? Is it possible to teach an adult to be good indoors if it was never taught that before? What do you do with a husky that insists on chasing cats? If memory serves me correctly, once a dog learns to chase animals and enjoy it, it is nearly impossible to train the dog out of it completely. All of my dogs are kept outside 24/7 except one. None of them has suffered from it, and they all love me just as much as the dog that comes indoors. They have shelter, and are fed, watered, and excercised daily. If I bring the outdoor dogs inside, they become nervous, and beg to be let out. They clearly show signs of stress, with tails tucked in and rapid panting. Again, they love me every bit as much as the indoor dog. I'm not saying every dog can or should be left outdoors, I'm only saying that it is not harmful for some. Thank you though for the post. I had been told by many Sibe people that some sibes can never be indoor dogs. ~Seij

My issues here: The Czechoslovakian wolfdog and Saarloos wolfhound... They aren't really "wolf hybrids" anymore. Although they were developed by breeding wolves to dogs, they are far enough removed from the wolves to be considered a pure breed of domestic dog, and not a "hybrid." The American Indian Dog... This is NOT a breed of dog!!! :x :evil: Please search the archives for my previous posts involving the Native American Indian dogs. It is a scam. These dogs posses neither the temperament nor the heritage that the breeders claim. I would hope that this dog could be removed entirely from the Index, it will do little more than help to perpetuate these breeders' lies. :( ~Seij

I know it may seem "cruel" to leave the dog outside 24/7, but believe it or not, SOME dogs [i]prefer[/i] to be outdoors. Siberian huskies especially. Some can be indoors, some can even be great indoors, but some are NOT good indoors. It is not at all uncommon for a husky to live outside 24/7 and [i]like[/i] it. Now, if the dog was tied outside to a tree or large metal pole, then I would be upset about it. BUT, if the dog was outside in a seemingly safe enclosure of some sort with shelter, food, water, etc., and there was a good reason for the dog being outdoors (i.e-would kill indoor cat, would eat furniture, just hates being inside in general), then this is called a freak accident. Lightning strikes cannot be predicted, and lightening can still hit when weather outside does not even look that threatening. ~Seij

[url]http://www.attackchi.org.au/kits.htm[/url] ~Seij

The shock collar works well on some dogs, not on others. If used on the "correct" dog and used properly, the shock collar is no more inhumane than any other training tool. I have grown up with four dogs that were trained on the collar since puppy hood. None has suffered any ill effects (the one dog is over 10 years old), the collars are set very low, and do not hurt the dogs at all. If used incorrectly, YES, the collar is inhumane. Isn't it like this with any training tool? Like I said earlier though, the collar is not right for every dog. Some dogs are fine with it, others freak out over it. It's a matter of trial and error, and knowing what your dog will (or won’t) respond to. FYI, I would never recommend the shock, prong, choke, or other such collar for a novice trainer. These types of tools, although they can do wonders for some dogs, can be abused and misused VERY easily by inexperienced owners. Unfortunately, this is part of what gives these collars such a bad rep--too many people just don't know how to use them properly, or they think it will automatically transform ANY dog it is put on. ~Seij

What the GSD's have are recessive blue eyes, and what appears to be a DOMINANT piebald gene. No, neither of these colors is mentioned in GSD standards because it is supposed to be impossible for GSD's to carry either of these traits--especially dominant piebalding, which is, if I researched right, a gene never before seen in ANY dog. ~Seij

*gasp* They've reinvented the wheel--I mean, litterbox!! [url]http://www.baynews9.com/content/36/2005/6/19/96410.html[/url] "Dog gone good idea Sunday, June 19, 2005 Pet ownership involves lots of love and lots of work. Nadine Wadsworth created Doggy Sod for the convenience of dog owners. When nature calls, however, some folks find themselves proving their commitment by taking their dogs out in the middle of the night or in bad weather. But now dog owners have another option, thanks to a Bay area entrepreneur. Doggy Sod is the creation of Treasure Island pet owner Nadine Wadsworth. She loves her dogs Autumn and Winter, but didn't want to have to take them down two flights of stairs in the middle of the night when they need to do their business. That's when she got the idea for Doggy Sod. "At that point I just devised a little box, and I put sod in it and it worked,'' Wadsworth said. "I trained them with it, and that's what started the whole thing. Then my neighbor saw me do it, and he ended up being my first client." Wadsworth said the key to the whole concept to Doggy Sod is service. Her clients don't have to worry about replacing sod or dealing with the messes left behind. "Basically we set it up,'' Wadsworth said. "We bring this plastic tray filled with fresh sod, and two weeks later we take that whole tray out with that sod, and replace it with a new tray with fresh sod." At first, Wadsworth targeted town homes, condos and boats with her idea. But she soon found that others could benefit from Doggy Sod. "Now people with multi-story homes use it because they have to go up and down two flight of stairs and there's beach homes, they don't have green space," Wadsworth said. A small 2 by 3-foot slice of innovation created in the Bay area that brings a whole new meaning to walking your dog. The Doggy Sod service is available to pet owners in Pinellas County. For information call (727) 420-5056. " ~Seij

Yes, that is what I meant, K. A dog, even if not chained for life, can become more territorial in the area where it is chained if it is left chained there frequently. This can be a dangerous situation for a child or other animal that happens to wander into the area. ~Seij

Yes, electric fences are the ones that shock them (usually though, it only takes one or two hits before a dog stays away from the perimeter for good). The fence is underground. Some dogs it works for, others not. A husky mix probably would not be a good candidate since huskies are very stubborn and can ignore the shock if they want through bad enough. I am not sure, but I also think chows might be a breed that fits into that catagory too. I think it is up to you though, to determine if your dogs would do well under the superviion of the electric fence. If the dog's responds well and faithfully to commands, and will quickly opt to avoid anything that causes pain, then yes, this fence might work well for them. On the other hand, if these dogs are very independant, frequently dissobey commands, and will suffer a bit of pain in order to get something they want, then this fence would probably NOT work well for them. Also, just to add, if the one with the husky in the mix acts a LOT like the typical husky, then solid, physical containment, such as a tall, secure fence or a kennel, are probably going to be the only effective and suitable containment options you have. Huskies love to roam and the only way to stop them it to have them physically contained (in general of course--there are always exceptions). ~Seij

First off, NEVER hit a dog after it has just come to you. In the dog's mind, it has just been punished for coming to you, not for being in the street. Chaining is not a good way to contain a dog, it is dangerous for both the dog and the people around it. Letting the dog run lose is also a very bad idea, as you obviously have discovered :wink: What kind of dogs are they? If no one in your family wants to build a fence, you could try an electric fence. They are not that expensive and could keep your dog in the yard if it's not one of the more stubborn breeds. Although many people may disagree with an electric fence, they are more humane than chaining or letting the dog run lose. There are also training techniques out there that could help, although I am not an expert in that area. Just know that regardless of how much training you do, if you let the dogs outside unattended without any sort of containment, there will always be a risk of them running off. My neighbors used to let their puppy run lose by a road (they euthanized the pup a few months later) but when my mom voiced her concerns to them about it, they said basically the same thing your mom did: "Well, what happens, happens." This coming from self professed animal lovers :roll: ~Seij

Hey guys I have known this breeder for a while now. She is very kind and very responsible. The dogs come from good, show quality lines. The "Panda shepherds" are a result of a random genetic mutation, and yes this has been genetically tested as the breeder says. She is not in it for money, but is hoping to develop the "breed" slowly for the sake of the dogs themselves, NOT money (personally, I think she is selling the dogs a little cheap--if she wanted to make money off of them, it would be easy for her to have bred every panda she has produced and sell the pups for a fortune. So far, she has done limited breeding, and to my knowledge, almost no advertising). Again, she is very responsible in her breeding practices, although she is risking her very name as a breeder to produce these dogs; it was not at all a snap-decision for her to breed Franka. I honor her for taking that chance. Genetic mutations don't come along everyday, especially ones like this. It appears to be a dominant piebald gene creating the dogs, which is unique since in all other dogs, piebalding is recessive. Even if Panda shepherds can contribute nothing to the shepherd breed itself, they can at least be given the chance to contribute to genetic science. Like I said, a mutation like this is not a daily event, and for the sake of knowledge, it should not be locked away just because it is “different.” (This world would never have gotten anywhere if standards were placed on everything, and nothing outside of those standards was ever allowed to grow and develop—we would still be in the Stone Age!) In Iceland, the saying is, “a good horse has no color.” IMO, the same should apply to dogs. ~Seij

Dog play can sometimes escalate into fighting like this. Wrestling can be a form of social testing for dogs, though it usually starts and end harmlessly. On occasion, however, it can suddenly escalate into actual fighting. Think of it like two kids who start pushing and shoving each other for fun, and then next thing you know they are in it with fists trying to actually damage one another. My own dog has tried getting out of hand like this with me. We would be wrestling and playing like normal, and within seconds it could turn into her flying into me with teeth and drawing blood and bruises. Not bad, but enough to scare me a bit. My solution to this was to teach her cut off signals and never let wrestling become too involved. She hasn’t been a problem since. My suggestion would be to watch over your two while they are wrestling, and break it up for a time out the second they start getting “wild.” ~Seij

That's ok, not bashing you for it :D OT topics are allways fun. ~Seij

[quote name='pyrless'][quote name='Canis erectus']Malamutes are the next macho-est thing to having a wolf or wolf/dog, and so get bred indescriminatley. [/quote] i am not laughing at you here canis, but i think it is funny that so many people think wolves and wolf-dogs are "macho" when in the wild they are so scared of us! [/quote] I am now feuling this little bit of off-topic-ness, but... Last week my Shilo was scared off by a Box Turtle. My br[i]aaave[/i] little wolf hybrid... :wink: ~Seij

Why is it that I keep hearing people say that malamutes are "unpredictable?" This is new for me--although I have never known any mals personally, I know plenty of people who do have this breed and they are all wonderful dogs by what they tell me. ~Seij

I know this has already been "sorta" discussed in another topic, but I wanted to address it on its own: What is your opinion on dogs that bite? What I mean is, if you had a dog that attacked or bit you or another person, what would your policy be? Do you think a dog should be PTS immediately for biting a human, regardless of the reason why it bit? Are there exceptions, instances where you think a bite or attack is acceptable? Do you believe in trying to train them out of it first? Would you only give a dog X-number of chances before you euthanized it for biting or attacking? (This list of questions could go on forever). I'm not looking for a debate; just give me what you think on the subject--what is your policy on dangerous dogs? My opinion: I believe that no dog [i]deserves[/i] to be PTS for biting or attacking, no matter who it was or what the circumstances were. It is my opinion that you should only euthanize a dog for biting/attacking if you fear for your own safety and/or the safety of others, you are unable to deal with/handle the issues that the dog has, and/or the dog is so dangerous that it must be kept locked away, no longer capable of living a free and fulfilled life. ~Seij

Just to add, I recently did a research project about wild animals vs domestic animals. In the end, I was able to conclude that probably the biggest (and possibly only) thing separating wild animals from domestic animals is there reliance on humans. Domestic animals tend to rely more on humans. Wild animals rely very little on humans, most of the time not at all. (Although in turn, reliance on humans also affects many other things, such as behavior intensity, how the animal react to different stimuli, etc). ~Seij