kendalyn Posted January 19, 2004 Share Posted January 19, 2004 Buck displayed some very odd behavior tonight and I am out of my mind worrying about it. Here is what happened: I was making leftover porkchops for dinner and I left the kitchen to go do something in another room. I came back and the pork chops were gone. I was shocked because Buck has NEVER been a counter surfer. In fact I often sit on the floor when I eat dinner and I can leave the plate on the carpet, go get something and the plate will not have been touched while I was gone. He has always just been exceptionally good about not stealing food. So I turned around and looked at him and just said "What happened to the pork chops?" My tone had changed but it wasn't really stern or angry sounding. He turned and slunk off to his crate right after I said it. So I stood in the kitchen for a while and thought about what happened. After about 5 minutes I walked over to his crate and kneeled down in front of it. Buck immediately started growling at me, and I knew he meant it. I just sat there for a minute stunned and then I said really stern "Buck, Quit it!" And he slid down on his belly and started wagging his tail. I walked away and he came out a few minutes later looking very unsure about what he should do. He kind of tiptoed past me and didn't want to come into the kitchen. He was laying down in the living room and I sat down next to him and he crawled toward me wagging his tail. I pet him and was friendly toward him and since then everything has been fine. I just don't understand this at all. 1) Buck has never been food aggressive. I can move his food around, take it away, put my hand in the bowl or whatever I want while he is eating. He has never even uttered a little growl. 2) His growling doesn't seem like food aggression to me because the pork chops were gone. He had already eaten them. So if the porkchops were gone the only other thing I can think of was that he felt cornered by me. But I have no idea why he would feel that way. I've never hit him or given him a reason to feel threatened by my presence. I am making an appointment with the vet tomorrow to have him looked over. Hopefully they can get him in soon. One thing I am going to do is stop giving him any kind of food that I eat. Sometimes I will put some of the meat I'm cooking into his bowl and I will usually let him eat food that drops on the ground (if it's not stuff that's bad for him). But for now, that's going to stop. I just don't know what to think of this behavior. It's very odd. Next time I see him eating I think I'll try to move his food bowl away and see if he has a problem with it. I just don't have any idea why this happened. Oh and here is some Buck history. I found him abandoned and very skinny in Kentucky. The vet thought he was about 6 months old when I found him so if that is accurate he would be 2 in February. As I said before food aggression hasn't been a problem in the past nor has any other kind of aggression. He has been very steady temperment wise. I don't know if he was abused before I found him although I've always suspected that he wasn't. He's not afraid of men and he's never cowered like he's afraid before. But I can't say for certain that he was never mistreated. I'm sure he wasn't loved though because he was abandoned and was skin and bones when I found him. *sigh* my heart hurts. I wish I knew what was going on. :cry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imported_Cassie Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 I would say pork chops would be very hard for any one including myself not to steal off the counter... :wink: The smell of pork chops would drive any dog to steal...geez, my Newf Tori just figured out how to open the door to my food closet and ate a whole bag of dog food...I had to stay home with her all day to be sure she didn't bloat. [quote]I came back and the pork chops were gone. I was shocked because Buck has NEVER been a counter surfer.[/quote] Dogs will be dogs, and even if they havent stolen any thing from the counter before there is always going to be a chance it will happen. Our dogs are prone to error, just as we humans are...and when you think about it...we humans do more dumb things than our dogs do! :lol: and we have the ability to rationalize and think things through first. :roll: [quote]In fact I often sit on the floor when I eat dinner and I can leave the plate on the carpet, go get something and the plate will not have been touched while I was gone. He has always just been exceptionally good about not stealing food.[/quote] I probably will not word this properly...but, Buck sees you with the food and knows it belongs to his master...he expects he will get a little of the left overs. [quote]So I turned around and looked at him and just said "What happened to the pork chops?" My tone had changed but it wasn't really stern or angry sounding. He turned and slunk off to his crate right after I said it. So I stood in the kitchen for a while and thought about what happened. After about 5 minutes I walked over to his crate and kneeled down in front of it. Buck immediately started growling at me, and I knew he meant it. I just sat there for a minute stunned and then I said really stern "Buck, Quit it!" And he slid down on his belly and started wagging his tail. I walked away and he came out a few minutes later looking very unsure about what he should do. He kind of tiptoed past me and didn't want to come into the kitchen. He was laying down in the living room and I sat down next to him and he crawled toward me wagging his tail. I pet him and was friendly toward him and since then everything has been fine.[/quote] Even if your tone of voice only slightly changed....our dogs also pick up on body language. Buck could tell you were upset about some thing...he probably was not associating it with the pork chops that he stole...a dogs gotta eat, its a natual thing...Buck was probably a little confused and found you to be unpredictable at that moment and went to his crate to get away...the crate would be bucks personal space and with you being in an unpredictable mood Buck wanted to get away from you and was being defensive. I have owned dogs which have done this...even coming home after a bad day at work the dogs pick up on your body language and your tone of voice and they can become either very submissive (mistaken for the dog understanding you had a bad day and is there to console you... :lol: ) or the dog just wants to get out of your way as you seem unpredictable...dogs don't understand bad moods etc. What Buck would have understood would have been...he takes the pork chops, you catch him in the act...you tell him in a loud voice "NO" and then take them from him...this a dog can understand....but, once they have already taken the pork chops, eaten them and they are doing some thing entirely different...Buck wasnt thinking about the pork chops any longer...dogs do not have day dreams of great meals...the purpose of eating was over...its a normal survival act for all species... The only thing I would do in this situation is chalk it up to experience and try to get Buck used to you patting him in his crate. You could also contact a behaviorist just ensure it is not the beginning of a serious behavior problem...I can only guess what happened, a behaviorist can actually see what is happening :wink: ....you are not alone...I have had this happen to me, and its happened to tons of other dog owners... :lol: When Buck came out wagging his tail perhaps summing up your current mood and perhaps a little frightened of what had just happened. Just remember one golden rule...if you don't catch you dog in the act of doing some thing wrong...don't get mad or upset at the dog...they do not remember things that happened 30 seconds ago...they only know that they are being punished for what ever they are doing wrong at that percise moment. One of my Newf's Cassie is very sensitive....some what like your Buck...I can't even disipline the other dogs in front of her...she gets very upset and goes to hide in my bedroom. Once my dogs have done some thing like this...guarding their personal space...I really start back on the nothing is free in life policy...just to reinforce good behavior...I use this method with all my dogs daily...it goes on for the life of the dog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kendalyn Posted January 20, 2004 Author Share Posted January 20, 2004 I know my demeaner changed mostly because I was so surprised I think. I didn't try to punish him but I'm sure he picked up on my mood. I have always petted him in the crate and not had a problem but I will do it more often from now on. I know this isn't rational but my feelings are hurt. I would never hurt Buck and I feel terrible that he would feel the need to protect his space from me. I'm over reacting I know. Ugh, my stomach is just in knots and I know I need to calm down because Buck knows something isn't right. I currently do NILIF but I will certainly continue it. Your post did make me feel a little better though Cassie. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajiesMom Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 Humm there must have been something in the air last night. I always give Magic a bed time snack and last night I cut up an apple and I peeled a banana but didn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
courtnek Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 the thing to realize here is MEAT...it's not dog food, or canned food, it's real MEAT...it's hard for a dog to pass that up, but since you didnt catch him in the act he didnt understand your change in attitude and body language. Dogs are scavengers, like wolves have to be sometimes, and if something smells like meat they will go for it. If he did in fact take it to his crate, then thats a double whammy. He already knows you're upset, he doesnt know why, and you are now insisting on getting into his space. Does he like peanut butter? I cured a dog of counter surfing by putting a HUGE dab of peanut butter on a plate, and letting him steal it, after I put his water up. he licked and swallowed and licked and swallowed for an hour afterwards, and never stole anything again after that. You have to BE THERE if you're going to do that, in case he needs his water, but it worked in this case when nothing else did, including moustraps.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kendalyn Posted January 20, 2004 Author Share Posted January 20, 2004 I thought maybe he had hid some of the pork chops in there and that's why he was so edgy but I couldn't find any traces of them. I think he ate them in the kitchen, I don't think they were in the crate. I'm not going to do anything about the counter surfing right now. I want to see if it's really going to be a problem. I mean, I'll watch where I put meat on the counters and that sort of thing but I don't think I need to do any sort of aversion training yet. Hopefully, just me being more careful will do the trick. I'm calming down now. geez, I've just never had my own dog growl at me like that before. It confused and scared me. And it confused and scared Buck too I guess! I'm still going to take him to the vet though. I want to make sure he's ok physically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kendalyn Posted January 21, 2004 Author Share Posted January 21, 2004 I tried moving the food bowl while Buck was eating today. Nothing happened. He just looked at me and wagged his tail! I also took away a bone while he was chewing it (I gave it right back after making him sit) and he didn't react at all! That made me very happy :-) I also petted him while he was in his crate. He was fine. He came out and tried to crawl into my lap. Obviously he doesn't fit but he tries! So Buck is back to his normal self. I'm pleased. I'm still taking him to the vet though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajiesMom Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 I'm glad to hear he is being his normal self again. Does he seem okay after eating cooked bones, are his poops regular and he's not sick? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kendalyn Posted January 21, 2004 Author Share Posted January 21, 2004 The chops were boneless so I don't have to worry about that. And yes his poops were normal today. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajiesMom Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 [quote name='kendalyn']The chops were boneless so I don't have to worry about that. And yes his poops were normal today. :D[/quote] I was wondering if they were boneless. That's good. Give Buck cuddles for me. :wink: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imported_Cassie Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 I'm so glad things are back on track with Buck...we have all gone through times when our dogs have reacted in very strange ways... :lol: and I know how dissappointing it can be and how you can feel your best friend just let you down...especially the only friend any one can have that has unconditional love. But, our dogs and other pets can have a very difficult time reading our body language and tone of voice...and any animal backed into a corner...or crate...will become defensive IF it feels it is being threatened...the will to survive is very powerful...the most difficult part is we become so in tune with our dogs that we start to feel as though they KNOW exactly what we are saying at all times...just chalk this up to experience...never get mad at Buck AFTER he has done some thing wrong...and believe me, no dog would thing a good meal of pork chops is wrong :lol: A trip to the vet is a very good idea...it will put your mind at ease to insure that there is nothing else going on with Buck. Good luck to you & Buck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
courtnek Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Buck's ok....it was just a bad pork chop experience....something he wanted so badly he couldnt resist stealing it, and then you got mad at him. He may have been growling in fear actually, since he knew you were mad but didnt know why. They dont think the way we do, that wasnt stealing, it was a free meal waiting to be taken....Laurel likes to countersurf - I keep all the food way out of her way. she doesnt do it unless there is something there she really wants, although she did break Freebee's glass dinner bowl because the food was on the counter and I had to leave the room a minute....I'm still finding glass shards.... :fadein: :fadein: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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