I still dont understand her....

[courtnek]

Laurel is getting to be a better dog every day, more confident, less scared...she has acquired this weird trait...when I am in the room with her she "protects" me...she bays and growls low if anyone, including my son, comes near. But if I'm not in the room, she lets people come in and pet her and makes no noise about it....

I came home and found Kyle sitting on the bed with her petting her and hugging her, and she was fine, even after I walked in. But if we are both in there, and Kyle walks by, she growls a little bit (low in her throat) and then starts baying....but if he walks in she will still let him pet her.

Wazzup with THAT????

She is very complicated....and hounds are different than any dog I;ve ever had.... I think she has bonded too closely to me, but I cant wean that bond yet....I still need to get more of her confidence up. I am now having him go in there when I'm not there and pet and talk to her (which she seems to like) and when she starts her attitude when I'm in there I shut her down with the "chill" command....

Is this weird, or is it just me?

[Malamum]

Are you sure it's a growl? What is her body language saying?

Indy makes all these weird and wonderful noises which somone may take as a growl or a threatning noise. However I know it's just his way of communicating - if he growls you really know about it.

I'm probably way off base - but just a thought.

[courtnek]

yea, it's a growl, but not a snarl. Low in the throat, then the bay starts, like it's a warning, but as soon as I say "chill" she will shut up and lay down - that's a taught command to stop barking. She hasnt worked up the courage to defend the door if someone comes by, and only seems to feel like defending when I'm in the room. She isnt really threatening, just warning. (However, if my son gets up at 3:00 a.m. to go to the bathroom, it's unnerving to have a dog baying...lol...) I feel she is protecting me, but I dont want her to feel that she needs to protect me from Kyle. With the life she had before this (kennel life, no real people around to bond to, lived in a pack of 20, very little human contact) she seems to think it's her job to stand by me, no matter what...but I wnat her to be more socialized with other people, and less afraid...she's SOOO complicated...

I've been sick for the last few days, so didnt get to take her to Petco. Maybe seeing other people besides us will help...

[Rosebud]

:lol:

Courtnek, are you absolutely positive that this is a low-warning growl? I am thrown by the baying after the growl. Baying is used in play, hunt and boredom, not really used as a protective measure.

Sally, Rocket & Sandy can get a bay challenge going once they really get heavy in playing with the toys.

Caleb does a low throat growl when you love on him, but it's a "oh, that feel really, really good, moan, moan growl"

Watch her ears, tail and neck and see if that body language indicates warning, she may just be happy to see him.

:angel:

[Guest Anonymous]

Now to me this is perfectly normal behavior...its basically a little bit of territorial aggression...mixed with a little personal space guarding...when you are in the room she has some thing to guard and she does not want to share you. My Rottweiler is the extreme of this behavior...if I am in my bedroom...this is "our" room...she will not allow any one in...if she is in there alone any one can come in...if the person is in the room before we enter then that is OK also. In my car its the same thing...when I am in the car she barks and screeches at every one passing by...when I have gotten out of the car to get some thing in a store I will watch her as I am walking back...she just sits there and does not let out a peep at passing people...even when I leave her in the car with some one else...not a peep until I get in the car then its back to guarding again! I also had the hardest time a while back with getting people in my car...when I picked up a friend of mine she would bark at my friend...so what I do is I take her out of the car...have my friend get in then put her back in...whole different story..basically she feels like...OK that person was here first...and my owner allowed her in the car...I do this with my bedroom now too...I take her out of the room, let the other person come in and then things are fine...she only guards "certain" rooms such as my bedroom as that is where we both sleep and she perhaps thinks I am more vunerable in my bed room...the same goes with the car...she comes to work with me and we spend alot of time traveling together in my car...this is "our personal territory"
We also find alot of our clients who bring their dogs in for grooming have some quirks like this as well...when we have smaller dogs dropped off most customers carry the dogs in...we always ask the owner to hand the dog to us...this makes a big difference in the dogs mind...the person the owner gives the dog to is the person the dog will let do all the awful things too it! :lol: I have actually seen a few times when I have been the one the owner has passed the dog too...the dog is perfectly fine with me, but, won't allow the other girls near it! You would be surprised at how dogs associate different spaces and items with their owners etc. I have also seen many times in the boarding facility having a very aggressive dog in for boarding...and the owner wants it walked! :o I take the dogs leash out...and as soon as it sees the leash it settles right down and turns into a happy go lucky dog.
I would probably let Laurel know that you are inviting your son into your room...even if it means taking Laruel out first letting your son go in and then bring her back in. I don't think I have ever owned a dog that wasn't just a little protective of my room. She may always be a little protective of your room...but, in time she will see that your son is a constant in your life and hers...its basically desenitizing her..and that can take time...maybe you could even have your son give her treats when he walks by your room...some thing really tasty that she loves. And keep any thing out of your room other than your self which she feels the need to guard from others such as toys, bones etc.

[Guest Anonymous]

[quote name='"Rosebud Baying is used in play, hunt and boredom, not really used as a protective measure.[/quote']

My neighbor's beagle bay at my dog when they're both in the back yards. Cricket (the Beagle) can't get to Sasha because of an invisible fence, and someone's always out with Sas to watch her, though she's pretty well boundary trained, and the only times in the last five (of 6) years we've had her that she's left the yard is when one of us is out of the yard and she wants to join us. One time that happened to involve going into the neighbor's yard after us while the beagle was out, and a fight broke out. So Cricket does not like Sasha, so her baying at Sasha is not in play.

Cricket also bays at us while we're in our own yard, and if we enter her yard. These people have had 1-10 beagles at a time for about 16 years now, so now I have this cringing reaction to baying, lol, and could never own a hound.

Meanwhile, back to the original thing, the best I can relate is when we have Sasha out (and this happens most often in Petsmart, where she meets lots of people), and either someone will look at her funny, or something about them strikes her wrong, and she'll start off with a growl, and it'll turn into a weird mixture of her woo-woo sound and a bark. In any case this has happened, I always laugh first, lest the people be scared (though no one has been), and then I slacken her leash so she can approach them, and she always does with her tail wagging (no one can be afraid of a big, curly pom-pom sweeping back and forth over the top of a fuzzy dog's back, huh :))... and once she actually makes it to that person and can sniff them, she's A-Okay.

The last time I was at Petsmart this actually happened twce, once when a staff member started walking toward us and making funny faces at her. He then knelt down and tried to make up for it by offering her a treat, but she usually doesn't accept treats from strangers, and never in a public place. So I think his feelings were hurt, lol. But then the next time she did it was when two elderly ladies turned down the cat food aisle! I couldn't believe her, rwarring at those old ladies :oops: Was also scared they'd be terrified a) because that might be terrifying and b) not all people coming down the cat aisles are going to be dog friendly. But they thought it was pretty amusing. My poor little bear is not as scary as she thinks, I guess (except to delivery people and door-to-door people).

Umm, that doesn't help at all, does it :oops: Sorry

Amber

[courtnek]

[quote]Courtnek, are you absolutely positive that this is a low-warning growl? I am thrown by the baying after the growl. Baying is used in play, hunt and boredom, not really used as a protective measure. [/quote]

Thanks Rosebud (AND everyone else!) I was hoping you woudl see this...

It SOUNDS like a warning growl, but maybe I'm wrong? As you know, I'm new in the hound arena...(and I'm LOVING IT....she's so DIFFERENT)

if she's laying down she will either raise her head or sit up, occasionally
stand, do the whole low growl thing, then put her head back and bay.
Her ears remain the same, and although she seems a little tenser than usual, she does not show what I would call aggressive body language.
Her tail, when she stands is straight out. Once he pets her she will wag it,
but it's almost like a challenge...When he pets her at first she seems a
little scared, her eyes are wide and she holds perfectly still, but then she calms down and relaxes. What do a hounds ears look like when they are
in guarding mode? do they flatten? stick up some?

her ears are of course very droopy....he has decided he's not afraid of her
(typical male) but I dont want her to snap at him or anything. So far she hasnt. If this is normal greeting by a hound, that's fine. I just need to
find out.

Thanks everyone!

:D

[Rosebud]

[quote name='courtnek'][quote]Courtnek, are you absolutely positive that this is a low-warning growl? I am thrown by the baying after the growl. Baying is used in play, hunt and boredom, not really used as a protective measure. [/quote]

Thanks Rosebud (AND everyone else!) I was hoping you woudl see this...

It SOUNDS like a warning growl, but maybe I'm wrong? As you know, I'm new in the hound arena...(and I'm LOVING IT....she's so DIFFERENT)

if she's laying down she will either raise her head or sit up, occasionally
stand, do the whole low growl thing, then put her head back and bay.
Her ears remain the same, and although she seems a little tenser than usual, she does not show what I would call aggressive body language.

[color=red]The fact that she occasionally stands is good, quickly jumping to her feet is definately a warning sign, sometimes now & then is she just hasn't come to fully trust him.[/color]

[b]Her tail, when she stands is straight out. [/b]

[color=red]This [b]is[/b] a warning sign, Caleb will balance his weight onto his front feet and the tail sticks straight out when he's warning Rocket, that's how I figured out that Caleb was secretly egging Rocket on.[/color]


Once he pets her she will wag it, but it's almost like a challenge...When he pets her at first she seems a little scared, her eyes are wide and she holds perfectly still, but then she calms down and relaxes. What do a hounds ears look like when they are in guarding mode? do they flatten? stick up some?

[color=red]They are very close to the head and laid back.[/color]

her ears are of course very droopy....he has decided he's not afraid of her
(typical male) but I dont want her to snap at him or anything. So far she hasnt. If this is normal greeting by a hound, that's fine. I just need to
find out.

Thanks everyone!

:D[/quote]

It sounds like Laurel is still unsure of your son, but she is coming around or she wouldn't wag her tail once he does pet her.

I do have a question, Have you had her eyes checked, it may be related to poor vision and once she realizes it's your son she's o.k.

Have him speak to her in his regular voice that he uses when your not around the next time she growls at him and she if she calms down without your instruction, if she does it's possibly her vision is not real good.

:angel:

[Guest Anonymous]

Having 2 Bloodhounds (which I LOVE :lol: ) I have one who refuses to let any other [b]dog[/b] anywhere near her food. :roll: She will do the low growl and it is followed by a bay. It is a different bay than her usual play bay more short and to the point! (If you can picture a short bay!) And like Rosebud said the tail straight out.. that is a sign with my girl too.

One other thing is my guys will bay if they hear things..it takes them a minute to "find" them because they are baying and jumping everywhere. So that may be the 3:00am thing.

Not sure about your guy but I know hounds take time. They are
"tender" souls. Mine question just about everything even if I say it is okay and still take a month to do it. :lol:
Your doing the right thing it just takes time. Let your son keep loving on him and spending time with him. I would get those eyes checked like Rose said as a precaution. :wink:

[Rosebud]

[quote name='*Jacsmom']Having 2 Bloodhounds (which I LOVE :lol: ) I have one who refuses to let any other [b]dog[/b] anywhere near her food. :roll: She will do the low growl and it is followed by a bay. It is a different bay than her usual play bay more short and to the point! (If you can picture a short bay!) And like Rosebud said the tail straight out.. that is a sign with my girl too.

One other thing is my guys will bay if they hear things..it takes them a minute to "find" them because they are baying and jumping everywhere. So that may be the 3:00am thing.

Not sure about your guy but I know hounds take time. They are
"tender" souls. Mine question just about everything even if I say it is okay and still take a month to do it. :lol:
Your doing the right thing it just takes time. Let your son keep loving on him and spending time with him. I would get those eyes checked like Rose said as a precaution. :wink:[/quote]

Jacsmom - Do your babies bark first and ask questions later. When I let Sally and Rocket out after dark, they ALWAYS bark once, listen and then let out the multiple short, quick barks if they don't like what they hear, see or smell.

[quote]They are "tender" souls. [/quote]

Sally and Rocket are so tender you can hurt their feelings with just a hard look.

:angel:

[Guest Anonymous]

Yep always bark then ask!! More so at night. Not that they would ever hurt anyone. :lol: You might get slobbered to death!
My boy is more long winded so he gives 2-3 bays and listens.. Maddie gives 1 and listens.

My guy, Forest, is more tender than my girl, Maddie. With him you can use a different tone or look and he just shuts down. However Maddie is more the free spirit and "it is my way" dog. She does have her moments though.. I really have to read her alot before we work to know how to talk to her..

[Rosebud]

:lol: :lol:

[quote name='*Jacsmom']Yep always bark then ask!! More so at night. Not that they would ever hurt anyone. :lol: You might get slobbered to death!
My boy is more long winded so he gives 2-3 bays and listens.. Maddie gives 1 and listens.

My guy, Forest, is more tender than my girl, Maddie. With him you can use a different tone or look and he just shuts down. However Maddie is more the free spirit and "it is my way" dog. She does have her moments though.. I really have to read her alot before we work to know how to talk to her..[/quote]

Are you sure you haven't just been spying on Sally & Rocket, you just described both of them for me!

Sally is more tender than Rocket, Rocket more independent (um, stubborn), but of the two Sally is more free spirit.

:angel:

[Guest Anonymous]

Courtnek, from taking a dog from a kennel life and bringing it into your home...I would say Laurel is doing WONDERFUL...that is how I always obtain my dogs straight from the kennel and little socialization except for the dog shows...it takes time for kennel dogs no matter the breed to get used to a home environment...unless of course they are like my 2 newest Newf's who took to home living like a cat takes to a running mouse! :lol: but, a submissive, unsure dog coming from a group of dogs to a home life is very stressful for the dog. Give Laurel more time, from the way she is progressing with your son she seems to be making leaps and bounds...it took my oldest female Newfoundland 1 solid year before she would stay out in the house with the "family" she was always using my room as a security blanket whenever she found herself unsure of a situation...she also did not like any one else in the family intruding in her private domaine...even though she would let them pat her at other times...she is a social freak now...and company! I can't keep her away from them...she is an attention hound...it took a long time...I didn't push her, every one in the household just acted normally and went about things as usual... Laurel will come around as well...just give her time...of course she is wary right now..don't coddle her which I know your not. :lol: just give her a chance to sort things out.

[courtnek]

thanks again everyone. Rose, I have wondered about her vision too....
I need to get her checked by the vet, but I too thought maybe she doesnt
recognize him right away until he gets close up...I guess I just assumed she would recognize him by smell, since they're scent hounds, but maybe
if she cant see well that's causing an issue - he may be frightening her without intending to.....

He just walked in the room, sat down and hugged her - I have asked him to talk quietly to her and not manhandle her, since I have discovered she is touch-sensitive.....so he just sat down, and petted her and talked to her, and she was fine. Never made a sound, it's only when I'm in there.

So maybe she just doesnt want to share me....I can believe that, she is very attached to me. And thanks Cassie - I can use all the encouragement I can get. I know that Kennel life, and pack hounds, and hunting is what she was bred for, but it just seems so sad that they dont take the time to give them people attention too. Oh well, she's mine now and that's the way it's gonna stay. Even if it takes a year or two....

She kinda grows on ya...her foster mom emails me every few days wanting to know how she is....

I never had a velcro dog before!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Guest Anonymous]

Court my hounds hate having their paws pushed on unless they are sleeping.
Touch sensitive...compared to the Lab yes but that is just them and their breed. They are gentle and kind with the heart of a giant. They love to be petted, rubbed, and scratched. However not to hard and not to soft. Laying around the yard or house is much better! They are not rough and tumble dogs UNLESS they are playing with each other (or the ocassional bounce mom game). Then they are rolling and bouncing off each other. Yes I have to let them win a game of tug because if not they get BORED and will walk off. :lol: Most of the time they walk off anyway.
May I suggested an old sock for a toy (tie a knot in it). Sounds corny but my hounds think old socks are better than steak!! Of course when I am not at home to watch I have to put up the socks! :wink:
She will come around.. The take their own time about things. Slowly but surely... Makes me wish I was more like them at times! :wink: