Help me convince to have dogs out of cold!

[Aroura]

Its winter here in Australia and it is getting very, very cold. I live at home with mum, so I don't make the rules with the dogs, so they are left stuck outside, freezing their little butts off, and there aint nothing I can do!!! I'm a great believer of indoor dogs, dogs should be a part of a family, just as any other family member. They are not just animals, they live in packs and have a social group, they should be included in family activities including sitting infront of a warm heater watching tv. Me and the dogs don't like it, but can deal with them being outside during summer, but this is ridiculous. Mum justifies it by letting them in the sunroom, where it is just as cold as outside and has a tiled floor! Mums in bed now so I just snuck the dogs inside after watching Lily, my 6mo boxer pup trying to sit down but couldn't because the floor was too cold for her butt!! Mum says they are big dogs and belong outside, I say they are part of the family and they have feelings too, so they should be inside with us. Mum lets my sisters Poodle cross, Puddles, in the house for most of the day. I also think this is wrong, to seperate members of the pack and favour one over the rest. From what I can see Lily feels the cold more than Puddles anyway, its just not fair!!!! Please help me convince mum that the right place for my dogs really is in here with me, I love them as if they were my children, and I'm telling you, if I had children I certainly wouldn't lock THEM outside in the cold!!! :o

[Guest roo]

As you live with mum it is really up to her, but personally it sounds like a very iffy situation, how old are you? I would get them a shelter in the garden, full it with vet bed or warm blankets. My oppinion is that they need warmth and a comfortable surrounding, How cold is it there? Do you or your parents pay for the keep of the dogs? If I were the breeder of the boxer pup and I knew it was going to live outside without shelter or comfort then i am afraid that the puppy would not be living at this house.
If mum is so addamant that they live out then you are going to have to give her all the sensible and ethical reasons why they need all of the above, debate the situation with her don't argue it. Use a book on the keeping of dogs to show her how they should be housed.
Good Luck, let us know how it ends up.

[Guest Anonymous]

I had always thought of Austrailia as being warm, how cold does it get there?[no metric please :wink: ] I know my dog loves the cold weather, I'll have to drag him in when its really cold but he loves the snow.He is an inside dog though so he doesnt stay out for more than an hour or two at a time, no matter what the weather.

[Guest Anonymous]

I agree with roo about not arguing... I am about to go through the same situation with my puppy, mind here in washington, USA it's summer (yesterday was 104 F!!!) I also feel that a dog is a part of the family... our last dog was an outdoor dog, but she didn't like to come in (unless it was the fourth of july, or a thunderstorm. then you couldn't stop her!) Hazel on the other hand is very much an indoor/outdoor dog. She will go out side but if you close the door on her she just sits by the door and waits for it to be opened. She's an australian sheperd and they are very attatched to thier people... thier nick name is velcro dog. I think she's even worse then my kids, she follows one of us around constantly!
Now what really gets me is that one dog is let in and the other isn't. Is the poodle the smaller version? Is your dog a hyper dog? (I just met a very hyper boxer and she was really cute, but she was bouncing off the walls!) Maybe if you train your dog to stay in one spot and not move around your "mum" would let you bring her in. I can't think it would be a hair issue.... as these dogs don't have a lot of hair.
Try the splat game, take a mouse pad or something of that nature and train the dog to lay on it, say "SPLAT" throw it on the the floor and have her lay on it, praising and maybe giving treats (depending on how you feel) Pretty soon try using other objects to play splat... then make her stay on the pad for a min.... then two min, with praise and treats. Soon you will have her staying in one spot, and the game is really fun to play too. Just don't let them chew on the mouse pad.... we've gone through two... :roll:
good luck

[Guest Anonymous]

Oh my gosh. My mom is the same way! I also belive in inside dogs but nooo my mom dosent. So in the winter it gets at the coldest about 15 degrees. So my beagle is out almost frozen. I have a sibe mix and he just streches out on the cold concrete! But my beagle dosent have that thick of a coat. We have a shed in the backyard that I first put rugs down (to insulate) then drag in dog houses, blankets, food bowls ext. But still he is cold. :( Right now its summer here and it is soo hot.

[Shannon_C]

Aren't parents strange, it does make you wonder how we became to love animals and want them everywhere with us, and yet our mothers and fathers are different in that respect.
My mum would never allow dogs and cats in the living room, only the kitchen....at one point they were only allowed in the toilet, then one day i discussed it with her to let them have the kitchen and then eventually the livingroom and so on.....although there were rows over it i did manage to convince her that animals have feelings too and how would she like to be left out in the cold.

I can see from Aroura's point of view that her dogs should not be left out in the cold, and why should they ? Winter of all months....they are our children but many adults still do it. I also dont agree that someone should favourite certain animals, its like favouriting your own children...they should all be loved the same. I see many pet owners being too houseproud to have hairs floating around, but i say why have them in the first place. (all it takes is a vacuum to clean them up)
It doesnt matter whether the dogs are big or small.....they still should have a warm and draft free place to sleep in.
I am with you on this Aroura :D

[GizmoRedNosePit]

For everyone that can not allow their dogs inside during the summer/winter....Do this

Winter:
Make a sturdy dog house made out of 2 by 4's and ply wood....not to exspensive....make it big enough for a full grown dog...take "security lights" I guess and type of light that conducts heat and put them up so you can turn them on and off...But make sure it doesn't get to hot or you will cook your dog! for the entrance have life a potato bag (not plastic ubt one of those heavy duty brown ones) hanging over the top so it doesn't loose to much of the heat....

Summer:
With summer you have to protect form heat so the ply wood should come off the dog house or the ply wood should get some type of paint that deflects the heat...and then make a fan in the hole that you can cover in the winter and open during the summer...and then make a misting system.....just ask at your local home depot or lowes and tey will show you....

That is just like inside....well close enough for our loved ones!! :wink:

[Guest Anonymous]

[quote name='Aroura']Its winter here in Australia and it is getting very, very cold. I live at home with mum, so I don't make the rules with the dogs, so they are left stuck outside, freezing their little butts off, and there aint nothing I can do!!! I'm a great believer of indoor dogs, dogs should be a part of a family, just as any other family member. They are not just animals, they live in packs and have a social group, they should be included in family activities including sitting infront of a warm heater watching tv. Me and the dogs don't like it, but can deal with them being outside during summer, but this is ridiculous. Mum justifies it by letting them in the sunroom, where it is just as cold as outside and has a tiled floor! Mums in bed now so I just snuck the dogs inside after watching Lily, my 6mo boxer pup trying to sit down but couldn't because the floor was too cold for her butt!! Mum says they are big dogs and belong outside, I say they are part of the family and they have feelings too, so they should be inside with us. Mum lets my sisters Poodle cross, Puddles, in the house for most of the day. I also think this is wrong, to seperate members of the pack and favour one over the rest. From what I can see Lily feels the cold more than Puddles anyway, its just not fair!!!! Please help me convince mum that the right place for my dogs really is in here with me, I love them as if they were my children, and I'm telling you, if I had children I certainly wouldn't lock THEM outside in the cold!!! :o
Let me recommend a training book for you to read Don't Shoot the Dog by Karen Pryor - has nice pleasant stuff that works on mom's as well as dogs :-)
I think you might want to check local humane regulations too as it sounds like the boxer for sure should be in and you might be in violation on housing the dogs.
As far as the sunroom goes how about a nice thick dog bed for the dogs to lie on in there? Or even a big cardboard box lined with blankets or hay to act as insulation for them - if the box had only a small hole in one side for dogs to slide in that would give them a draft free area they could warm with their body heat. Maybe your mom will get the hint when you drag home some appliance delivery box to fit in the sunroom for the dog....

[Aroura]

roo napisał(a):

How cold is it there? Do you or your parents pay for the keep of the dogs? If I were the breeder of the boxer pup and I knew it was going to live outside without shelter or comfort then i am afraid that the puppy would not be living at this house.

I'm 19, it gets cold enough to snow here sometimes and very windy. The dogs are soley my responsibility, I feed them, play with them, pay for their food and vet bills etc. Dad walks them though, as well as me because its something he likes to do. When I bought Lily from the breeder I was living by myself at the time in a nice house with a big backyard right nextdoor to a dog park. I wasn't to know at that stage how short my stay there would be. I'm currently looking for a house to rent where I can have my dogs indoors, but its hard to find people to move out with. Its a hard life being a teenager!!! :lol:

[GizmoRedNosePit]

Aroura!! I totally agree...you think life is so easy then you move out and life is so hard!!

I was in your situation just a couple months back....our x roomate took our money and didn't pay the bills....well that caused us to get evicted....Gizmo was only 2-3 months old....I ended up moving backin with my dad with my boyfriend.....it's alot easier now....

[Guest roo]

Aroura,
Hope everything works out ok, please please keep us all informed
Roo :lol:

[Aroura]

Will be sure to keep you all posted. At the moment I've been sneaking the dogs into my room whenever possible, my bedroom has a door to the backyard :P Still, thats no good when mum comes in and finds them. I think she's beggining to not mind as much, so long as they are quiet and sleeping in my room and I don't have them in too often. Its a comprimise, but I will keep trying to convince her they should be inside just that little bit more often, and then that little bit more again, and then some more... :wink:
I'll let you know how it goes, who knows, in a few weeks I could be sitting here typing with the dogs at my feet!!! :D

[Guest Anonymous]

I am just shocked to hear that dogs are being left outdoors year round. That is inexcusible...cruel...and illegal in civilized countries. If a dog owner can not provide indoor shelter for their dog, they should put the interests of the dog before their own and find the dog a new home. No amount of love is going to prevent a dog from freezing to death. Sometimes in life we have to make tough decisions. Part of being a responsible adult is recognizing our limitations and shortcomings and putting the interests of others before our own.

[Aroura]

[quote name='nicki']I am just shocked to hear that dogs are being left outdoors year round. That is inexcusible...cruel...and illegal in civilized countries. If a dog owner can not provide indoor shelter for their dog, they should put the interests of the dog before their own and find the dog a new home. No amount of love is going to prevent a dog from freezing to death. Sometimes in life we have to make tough decisions. Part of being a responsible adult is recognizing our limitations and shortcomings and putting the interests of others before our own.

ARE YOU SUGGESTING I GIVE MY DOGS AWAY???!!! I LOVE THEM MORE THAN ANYTHING ELSE IN THE WORLD AND I CAN'T BELEIVE YOU WOULD HAVE THE NERVE TO EVEN SUGGEST THAT!!!! OBVIOUSLY I AM TRYING TO FIND A WAY AROUND IT, AND THE SITUATION IS ONLY TEMPERARY, UNTIL I CAN FIND A WAY AROUND IT!!!!! THEY ARE NOT FREEZING TO DEATH, THEY ARE JUST SHIVERING, AND IF I WERE TO GIVE THEM AWAY HOW WOULD I EVER KNOW THAT THEY WERE BEING LOOKED AFTER PROPERLY? I LOVE MY DOGS AND TAKE THE VERY BEST CARE POSSIBLE FOR THEM, A LITTLE BIT OF COLD ISN'T GOING TO KILL THEM. I WANT WHAT IS BEST FOR THEM, AND UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES WILL I EVER GIVE THEM AWAY.
For all you other people you can understand and sympethise with my situation, I just want to let you know the dogs sleep in my room now next to the heater. Great news huh? :D

[Guest Anonymous]

Where do you live nicki? cause if you live in the states you should know that there are a lot of dogs that live outside.. including mine. :roll: good luck aroura! :D hey at least your dogs have a loving home that dosent abuse them and at least they get fresh food and water every day! (i hope!)

[Guest Anonymous]

I do live in the states...connecticut...and every state I know of have has laws mandating the owner to provide shelter in cold or very hot weather...even rain.

Putting aside the laws, I think it is common sense and the norm that dogs should not be kept outdoors in winter with weather so cold that it is snowing as stated in original post with no protection. It is cruel and inhumane...if the dog doesn't freeze, it will surely incur health problems. Where has it ever been stated that this practice is not dangerous to the dog?

Why do you have dogs and don't allow them in your house? What shelter do your dogs have outdoors? I have animals because I enjoy my relationship with them, they are part of my family and they reside in the house. I really think most people view it that way.

I feel very strongly that a dog owner has the responsibility to provide shelter for their dog. It goes along with providing food, water and medical care. If for what ever reason a dog owner is not able to provide these basics, I don't believe they should own a dog.

And if you don't think these dogs are freezing out there, dress up in your winter coat, hat and gloves and spend a night with them and then tell me it is not freezing out there.

I am truly shocked that dogs are being kept outdoors 24/7. We sit here and talk about training, health care and just loving our guys...and then I hear dogs are out in the snow. I would have never expected to hear that.

[Guest Anonymous]

Beagle88...in the state of Washington...it is a charge of criminal animal cruelty not to provide adequate shelter against the elements. I don't think the shed you described in your post is considered adequate shelter. You should check into this.

[GizmoRedNosePit]

I think there should be laws everywhere.....dogs should have a good shelter...sure they have fur and all the stuff out side animals need......but still they are suppose to be our companions! They should have shelter :D

[Guest Anonymous]

Okay I read the original post like 5x's and did not see where Aroura said they did not have shelter. So my question is do the dogs (Puddles and Lily :) ) have shelter? I realize that they are cold and you want them inside as would most owners. I just did not want to jump to any conclusions and say that they did not have a house, of course any dog or cat is going to get cold in snow and wind.

Not every owner in the world lets their animals in the house. Breeders with 20-25 dogs definately do not let every dog in their home but do have heated and cooled kennels for the dogs. Owners can provide shade, misting systems, pools, houses, shavings, blankets, and etc for protection from weather of all sorts. In most states it is considered animal cruelty if they(animal cruelty officers) find that an owner is not providing proper shelter for an animal from weather. This varies from state to state as far as the 'codes' to what is considered adequate but it is still punishable by law (usually a fine and/or removal of animal if not changed). :wink:

[Guest Anonymous]

nicki napisał(a):

Beagle88...in the state of Washington...it is a charge of criminal animal cruelty not to provide adequate shelter against the elements. I don't think the shed you described in your post is considered adequate shelter. You should check into this.

ok well since you havent seen the shed dont assume things. Also if that is the law then our state must not be very lawful because every were you look there are dogs outside in the cold, rain, wind and heat with no sheltar. I would have my dogs inside if I could.. but its my mom who makes the rules. Plus when its really hot outside I bring them icewater like every hour, provide them lots of shade, and don't exersize them (only at night when its cool)

then when its really cold in the winter (like the coldest days) I will take them to petsmart to escape the cold or go over to my friends house and bring the dogs in or go to another pet shop whom my very good friends own. Also we set up heat lamps in the shed and sit with them in the shed for a few hours and read or whatever, but we never leave the heat lamps going when we are not there. Also if my dog (one of them) is streched out on the cold cement hes proubly not to cold.

[Guest Anonymous]

THEY ARE NOT FREEZING TO DEATH, THEY ARE JUST SHIVERING,

In all of her posts on this thread, she never once mentions any shelter whatsoever. I think it is fair to assume that no shelter is provided or whatever shelter is provided it is not adequate. By her own admission, she stated that her dogs are shivering.

By no means do these dogs have heated and cooled shelters like you mentioned. Such shelters are extremely expensive and can easily cost $25,000.

[Guest Anonymous]

[quote name='nicki']I do live in the states...connecticut...and every state I know of have has laws mandating the owner to provide shelter in cold or very hot weather...even rain.

Putting aside the laws, I think it is common sense and the norm that dogs should not be kept outdoors in winter with weather so cold that it is snowing as stated in original post with no protection. It is cruel and inhumane...if the dog doesn't freeze, it will surely incur health problems. Where has it ever been stated that this practice is not dangerous to the dog?
Siberian Huskys were bred to be in even colder temps than washington. beagles were bred in england (they think) correct me if I wrong but its not exactly warm in mid winter in england.

Why do you have dogs and don't allow them in your house? What shelter do your dogs have outdoors? I have animals because I enjoy my relationship with them, they are part of my family and they reside in the house. I really think most people view it that way.

well try telling that to my mom. She is my mom and I can't tell her what to do. I'm not saying I don't sneak them in sometimes I'm just saying this is her house and I will follow her rules till I move out on my own.

I feel very strongly that a dog owner has the responsibility to provide shelter for their dog. It goes along with providing food, water and medical care. If for what ever reason a dog owner is not able to provide these basics, I don't believe they should own a dog.

and I do so no proublem there.

And if you don't think these dogs are freezing out there, dress up in your winter coat, hat and gloves and spend a night with them and then tell me it is not freezing out there.

You don't have to belive me if you don't want to but I have. In their shed and its really not to bad especially since I isulate it so well.

I am truly shocked that dogs are being kept outdoors 24/7. We sit here and talk about training, health care and just loving our guys...and then I hear dogs are out in the snow. I would have never expected to hear that.

well at least we don't sit here and hit and kick our dogs my dogs have in better than most dogs so instead of getting all worked up about what people do with inside/outside dogs go get worked up on the fight aganist animal abuse. Have a nice day

[Guest Anonymous]

beagle88...that is the law in the state of washington and you can very easily look it up if you were interested as it is on the internet...it is listed under animal cruelty.

I can make a lot of assumptions about this shed. If you are bringing your dogs to stores to escape the cold and periodically using heat lamps to warm them, it tells me that the shed is not adequate shelter. While you are in your bed every night nice and toasty, your dogs are outside and cold.

And I did assume correctly that this shed was not heated. I'm sorry if you are offended but you are not providing proper shelter for your dogs. You may not like me saying it, but you know I'm right. You wouldn't be taking these dogs to stores to warm them up and sitting there with heat lamps if I was wrong.

[Guest Anonymous]

Well you din't offend me but are rude. You haven't seen the shed. My mom makes the rules and if you don't like them i will give you her email address so you can tell her not me. And I take them to the stores so that they will be out of the cold. So what you should be saying oh good at least your doing that instead you come back with more things that basically say I am an animal abuser. Well the dog next door has NO sheltar wind rain no sheltar. Thats animal abuse. And no you are not right you are wrong. You have not seen the shed ok! YOU HAVE NOT SEEN THE SHED. Say that to yourselve. Its huge the doors are shut (dog door in them) and yes.. you guessed again. How would we have heat lamps and light to read by.. hmmmm.. maybe because there is electricity in the shed. There are 2 grooming tables in the shed, there are 3 kennels in the shed , there is one extra large dog loo in the shed. Its a big shed. They have tons of room in it and they can esacpe snow, wind, rain, and even the heat. And yes I go to bed warm every night so do my dogs out in theor shed. I would have it diffrent it I could but I can't so leave me alone. And have you ever been to washington in the winter lately? This last year it was not very cold at all. The coldest days were like 17. Thats not very cold when you have a huge shed and a thick winter coat. I am into alot of activites 4-h, handling classes, obedience classes and more. With all of my dogs are involved so they do get to escape the cold but they don't need to. I could leave them at home but I want to get them inside so if you were thinking like me which you werent you could see that I'm trying to make the best of the situation.

[Guest Anonymous]

Beagle88 I think your shed sounds fine!! :P Neighbors dogs probably sneak over at night to visit! :wink: In fact cruelty officers would probably laugh if someone called them on your "shed"!! :D

Nikki my point was that not everyone brings their dogs in. People around here just have basic igloo house or just old dog houses. I have worked and talked with animal cruelty officers and you would be amazed what gets by!! The reason I asked about the shelter is because she never did mention a shelter so I was just wondering if she forgot and I was not going to jump on it with out knowing everything... :wink: