Scared for my dogs life....

[Jetta_Pup]

Ya know what. Ive only met a hand full of pitts and a hand full of shelties. And all ive seen. I think my jetta would bite someone before the pitts ive met would. :o but shelties are not an "agresive breed". Any dog breed owner age can do what it wants when it wants. Should we start making publications about an "agresive breed" in humans? WHY HE** NO! why? because thats racist. But no one hears jack &^%$&^$ about people being racist to dogs. If only dogs could speak our language a point could go through. And untill dogs learn english im afraid were stuck where we are.

[Horsefeathers!]

I think when some who are going on about "reacting on human emotion" aren't realizing is that [u]ALL[/u] we had to go on was the story posted. I think we said repeatedly that we were basing our opinions on what we read and agreed that our opinions would likely change if something new were to come up. *reading back* Yeah, that's what we said. I STILL hold true to my beliefs that [u]if[/u] it had happened as originally posted, the dog would have been considered dangerous.

Sorry, but I just resent the notion that we were reacting based solely on emotion and without the intelligence to consider that the story could have been twisted. Who here has ever said they take media stories as gospel? Now that other facts have come to light, OF COURSE it makes a difference. I don't know how many more times we could have posted that.

Thanks to *K* for digging up more. It does make a difference.

[quote]3 puncture wounds? not nearly enough to constitute a vicious attack! come on people --do you have any idea the damage a dog could do if he intended that attack, people have died![/quote]
I still disagree, though at this point it doesn't seem to apply to THIS story. I'm never going to believe that it's not a vicious attack unless someone dies or is horribly maimed.

[Horsefeathers!]

[quote name='DivineOblivion19'][color=indigo]HF I can't help but think you are replying to my post. I'm not PO'd at anyone here. I'm mad about the people who were "attacked" that have told a totally different story. When I said "Funny how things change when you hear the other side of the story...." I wasn't saying that people's opinions here have changed I meant funny how much people tell a completely different story and make up lies from what really happened. Sorry if I stated that kind strangely but I was so mad after reading K's post I was seeing red. :wink: [/color][/quote]

NO, DO, not you. It was in reference to Rotten Two's posting. Something about the wording of it that made it seem sort of insulting. Maybe I read her(?) wrong.

[DogPaddle]

[quote]ok so let's say joe schmoe shih tzu owner is walking down the street. he has taken no precaution (direct stop, big stick, treats) in case of a meeting with a strange and aggressive dog. [/quote]

Do you generally take precautions and cary a big stick when you walk your dog?

[Shenanigans]

[quote]my point in that paragraph was that had this guy been educated enough he could have avoided a bite and harm to his dog or family. i am sorry if you feel highly disturbed by what i said. i will try to offer some explanation. [/quote]

I don't know if that is true really. I've had a pit bull come after my Sheltie once, and while there was a good 20 feet between us, I don't need to tell you, that the dog was moving extrodinarily fast, and there was nothing short of a freight train that was going to stop that dog. At this point, it was either letting my Sheltie be mauled or picking up my dog, which I did and I got bitten. I accepted this fact, however in this case, the decision on whether to press charges weren't in my hands, but the police's and in the end the dog was destroyed.

It was probably the best case scenario as the owner had set the dog on us, he had done so to several people before, but was always able to call the dog out last moment, just to scare the piss out of them, but not this time, and at that time, the 16 year old girl I was got a nasty bite. The following year, I went out to protest a breed ban in Toronto.

This is a sad chain of events, the collar malfunction, the dog jumping up on the man, the man kicking the dog and the other dog biting the man. I have to admit that many of these are causing gut reactions in me for each and every instance, so I'm sure the fallout will probably be very difficult for pit bull owners in London (strangely enough, I had a strange memory that they were already banned). Could this have been prevented? Maybe, maybe not.

I might get roasted for this, but I don't feel a strong sense of anger towards the man for kicking the dog. An ordinary Joe Schmoe who has his Shih Tzu in his arms and a Pit Bull jumping on him, is going to be inclined to protect his dog. I don't think he should have done it, but I don't think that it was planned on his part either. What I am angry about is the selective amount of media this is getting and it would seem this couple's participation in that, but I'm not surprised at all.

I think this is a good lesson for everyone to double check your collars and leads and buy high quality, especially if your dog is the type who would drag you across the street for an item and has a poor recall (which also should always be worked on, as well as a strong STAY). These are lifelines to our dogs and we need to be on top of the lifesaving equipment we use just as much as our dogs.

[Cairn6]

[quote name='DogPaddle'][quote]ok so let's say joe schmoe shih tzu owner is walking down the street. he has taken no precaution (direct stop, big stick, treats) in case of a meeting with a strange and aggressive dog. [/quote]

Do you generally take precautions and cary a big stick when you walk your dog?[/quote]
I agree with Dog Paddle. You can't blame Joe Schmoe Shih Tzu owner for the attack. If I can find fault in this case it would be that the pit owner didn't have full control of her dogs. You must always have full control. I know accidents happen but then you have to be ready for the consequences. I think they are harsh in this case and most likely wouldn't be so harsh if it were another breed of dog. But still you must have control.

[imported_Debbie]

[quote name='Cairn6'][quote name='DogPaddle'][quote]ok so let's say joe schmoe shih tzu owner is walking down the street. he has taken no precaution (direct stop, big stick, treats) in case of a meeting with a strange and aggressive dog. [/quote]

Do you generally take precautions and cary a big stick when you walk your dog?[/quote]
I agree with Dog Paddle. You can't blame Joe Schmoe Shih Tzu owner for the attack. If I can find fault in this case it would be that the pit owner didn't have full control of her dogs. You must always have full control. I know accidents happen but then you have to be ready for the consequences. I think they are harsh in this case and most likely wouldn't be so harsh if it were another breed of dog. But still you must have control.[/quote]


I totally agree with the both of you....... :wink:
I don't usually think about going out with my dogs for walks armed to the teeth....... :roll:
that just really upsets me that the Shih Tzu owner is being "blamed".
I have two Jacks and I know that small dogs are not necessarily the most popular on this site, but I don't think I should have to arm myself when I go for walks.......just because some irresponisble dog owner can't control their dogs. I certainly make sure my dogs are under control at all times.
I also own a rather large Lab/Rott, and I walk her separately from the Jacks just because she's so strong. "I" know my limitations. :wink:

[Cairn6]

Yeah my sister in law has a Mastiff/lab and when I dog sit I can't walk her she is just too big and they have never taught her a thing. The only one capable of walking her is my brother no one else is strong enough. She would never hurt a fly she is the sweetest dog put on earth but if she got loose she could get hurt so it's for the safety of the dog as well as others to keep your dog under control.

[Shenanigans]

I have two big dogs too, and while I can if I have to walk them both together, I'd rather not. When I'm home alone, I take them out seperately, and it's more work for me, but I know if they both really wanted to, they could overpower me.

It took an incident where I had them both out and on leads on my front lawn for a pee, and my inlaws walked up the street, naturally the boys wanted to see grandma and grandpa and I had a seriously hard time in controlling them. Mind you, I only had them on their regular collars, for control I use a choke chain on Shenanigans and a halti on Banzai.

I generally go through great lengths to let small dog owners that my dogs won't eat them even if they are provoked (Shenanigans once had a Manchester Terrier hanging off his face and didn't do a thing) and Banzai just skillfully avoids any attacks. Because I grew up with Shelties, and knew the fear that one has when they see a big dog that looks like it's longing for a meal of small dog. It might not be justified as in the case of my two, but you've got to be careful with those wee ones. Nowadays when I'm sitting Shelties, I'm a nervous wreck walking them.

[Canis erectus]

I think it's interesting to note that up until last year I used to live in a rural area where alot of dogs were let outside unsupervised off-leash. Whenever we took the dogs for a walk I almost always carried pepper spray or a stick. Anytime I wanted to take a new walking route I had to do a stake-out in order to familiarize myself with whatever dogs lived on a given street. It was always a given that anytime you took your dogs out you just might get rushed by another dog (or pack of dogs).
I live in the 'burbs now and no one, not even myself anymore, takes such precautions. Most every dog is kept under control and the animal control dept. responds promptly and appropriatley to complaints. So what if the typical suburban resident (at least where I'm at) get attacked by another dog? They wouldn't likely be prepared, they weren't expecting it. Whereas the rural resident would be far more likely to be prepared if that happened.
I dunno, I think it's interesting to note the different mindsets.

[DogPaddle]

I lived out in the country for a while. No one had fenced yards and some of their dogs did tend to stray or pack up a bit. None of them attacked people or dogs though. I wonder why your area was different? Weird.
I really miss living out there :( I would have to build a fence or a big big dog run if I moved back out there though. It only takes one car or grouchy farmer with a gun . . .

[rotten_two]

the great thing about this board is that everyone is entitled to their opinion. the not so great thing about this board is that everything is typed and i think therefore the real meaning or intention is not always interpreted correctly.

if i came off as insulting then i apologize [img]http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/23/23_29_104iv.gif[/img]. it is not my intent to hurt anyone's feelings. i do not apologize, however, for my opinion. i have no ill will toward anyone and i enjoy hearing different takes on things. i am not so closed minded to expect that everyone believes as i do either, but i do expect the same privilege to post my own opinions. that being said i think it is fair to say we can agree to disagree -- amicably! subjects like this tend to get everyone fired up -- me included.


now let me try to address some of the questions that have been thrown my way . . . good lord where to start haha

1) horsefeathers first -- no particular reason except that you were the first post i found with a comment directed at my post (however subtle that direction was).

[quote]I think when some who are going on about "reacting on human emotion" aren't realizing is that ALL we had to go on was the story posted.[/quote]

this *some* is me as noted in a later post. here is what i was trying to say with the human emotion comments . . .
what is the first thing that most people say/think when they hear about a dog bite/attack incident? <gasp> <gasp> oh my gosh that poor person and sometimes some people are quick to say kill the dog!

when i hear about a dog bite incident i no longer experience the shock of it all and i try to take the details of the story (yes the media skews things) and run at it from the dog's pov. so even with the first very skewed version of this story when you approach it from the pit's perspective you can surmise that the pit wanted the small dog right? ok so my point was that after we get past the initial shock and gasps (human emotion) of the news -- then we can get down to the nitty gritty of what might have triggered the dog to act in such a way. i hope that makes sense -- i was not trying to insult anyone, rather provide another way to look at things.

[quote]I'm never going to believe that it's not a vicious attack unless someone dies or is horribly maimed.[/quote]

this is your opinion and apparently that of many others and i totally respect that!


2) dog paddle cairn6 debbie

[quote]Do you generally take precautions and cary a big stick when you walk your dog?[/quote]


honestly i do not carry a stick but i do carry treats and an extra leash in case of an emergency. i also keep an eye out for potential problems. the treats to throw at a dog to distract and the leash if i need to get hold of a fighter/biter or even to leash a loose dog until we can find owners or make other arrangements -- yes a dog lasso of sorts hahah.

i was not saying you have to go out in full armor -- just take a few extra precautions. hopefully the majority of us will never need it -- but it is better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it ;) i was trying to offer up a few suggestions of things to do to distract an approaching dog -- i did not mean to imply you should employ them all at once.

i was not suggesting this was the man's fault -- merely stating that there were other options vice picking up the dog. again if you don't agree i am fine with that - i think picking up the dog is the natural primate reaction -- unfortunately dogs are a bit rusty on their primate.


i hope i addressed the major points and maybe provided some clarity, sorry if i missed anyone who might have had questions. i do not intentionally try to hurt or confuse anyone. that is all i will say on this subject. *zipping my lip* [img]http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/10/10_5_3.gif[/img]


mmmm *unzipping* i will of course address future subjects hee hee

[imported_Debbie]

:wink: R2, That's the great thing about this site :D !! Everyone can voice their own opinon without being scorched for it !! (hopefully...)
I really think that no one thought that the man deserved to be bit, and was only doing what came on instinct (lifting dog up)
Accidents do happen with equipment, but we all have to be responsible dog owners and handle what may come our way. :wink:

P.S....love that scusa emoticon !! :lol: